JUNELELE
FUMA
- 27 March 2018
Some of my player highlights from our Full Manual Pro Club
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Very beautiful. For me the 11vs11 modes on both FIFA and PES, who seem more slow and physical AND have midfield phase , shows directly that the problem on both games is the halfarsed AI, that can't compete with human in role playing, transitions and off the ball movement, resulting to this end to end mess in all 1P games, offline career modes and online pvp modes.Some of my player highlights from our Full Manual Pro Club
On Professional, you may have more license to adjust the lines, relative to the marking. If it seems they are essentially parking the bus (not 100% like in FIFA 15, but still we'll say defensive third), you can raise the Length to at highest 48. That would be a global change. The second part would be to pay attention to formations faced and of course the tactics chosen. A high marking value is going to drag players out of position more, but it's relative to the run frequency used as well. If you have run frequency at 50, and marking at 72, then you're going to get a lot more out of position plays because run frequency not only controls how many runs, but how far the runs extend to. Lower run frequency, and they will make a variety of runs, but the run will end with a checking back to the ball - unless you have manually set them on a run and/or their player instructions are set to go inside, overlap, etc.
Hope that helps. Glad you're enjoying it. I think professional is a fun difficulty, my only issue was that it was too easy to tackle the ball away from the CPU, regardless of creating acceleration discrepancies, among other things.
Are you not saying the same things there? The article is saying "what about average players, where are the changes for them, and why are FUT players forcing rushed changes to the game that deviate so far from the original vision" - you're saying "average players don't care about FUT-driven changes".It's frustrating that, in a year in which EA is hosting multiple FIFA esports events across the globe, there isn't greater visibility on what's being done to improve the game for average players.
Guess what, average players don't give a shit about any of these mechanics they are crying about. I think they fail to realize that not everyone competes in the FUT Weekend League.
Hey guys. Here's a thing.
I've just played FIFA 18's World Cup add-on, after finding 17 a bit unresponsive and not quite as brilliant as I remember.
Surprisingly, I loved it. The pace on "slow", was too slow. That BLEW MY MIND given how fast FIFA games are. Defenders defend, there's individuality... and you can't exploit the game easily using fast players. (Believe me, I tried.)
Anyway - this got me looking at reviews, of 18, 19 and 20 (getting to the point now, and why I'm posting this here).
But what really gets me... Remember when @Matt10 was talking about how good the FIFA 20 beta was? (I experienced it - it REALLY WAS.) Along with Operation Sports, and the presentation they saw that showed how committed to realism they were? Then, between beta and final... The game turned to absolute shit? And now, we get monthly updates to fix FUT moans, and half the time they're rushed and break other parts of the game?
It all started with FIFA 19. Check out this article, seriously. It's like the blueprint.
@Matt10 Thanks so much that really helped.
One other question are you (or anyone) still seeing the weird free kick bug from the a.i? It seems since last update its back where the CPU fires in rocket free kicks, usually overhit, straight out of play? Is it a camera issue? When they have a free kick around the box its ok. its when its mid way into the half.
Anybody seeing this?
No, that's a misunderstanding, I'm trying to say that these FUT driven changes have minimal impact on anyone who's not actively trying to exploit the game. Average players won't even realize that something changed. Of course the game could do with certain improvements, but what they are demanding is exactly the wrong way to go. We need general improvements, not eSports balancing or increasing the skill gap with an even more convoluted control scheme.Are you not saying the same things there? The article is saying "what about average players, where are the changes for them, and why are FUT players forcing rushed changes to the game that deviate so far from the original vision" - you're saying "average players don't care about FUT-driven changes".
I'm surprised at your strong reaction when everything that you're saying, I feel like is repeated in the article (albeit with references to what online players are feeling)! I thought it was a great article, and unusual - how often does a website review something and then go back to say "actually, we STRONGLY disagree with what the developers have, and are, doing to it through its life-cycle"?
Funnily enough, as I recall it, FIFA 18 felt more frantic to me than FIFA 17 and FIFA 19.Playing FIFA 18 and feeling how much slower, more difficult to exploit and generally more realistic it is in terms of a representation of football (IMO) - which is driven by gameplay changes not being made instantly for FUT whiners, and by the vision not deviating wildly from the original vision... I just feel like the path of the modern games is so wrong.
19 and 20 are so much faster and floatier it's unreal, to me.
Hey guys. Here's a thing.
I've just played FIFA 18's World Cup add-on, after finding 17 a bit unresponsive and not quite as brilliant as I remember.
Surprisingly, I loved it. The pace on "slow", was too slow. That BLEW MY MIND given how fast FIFA games are. Defenders defend, there's individuality... and you can't exploit the game easily using fast players. (Believe me, I tried.)
Anyway - this got me looking at reviews, of 18, 19 and 20 (getting to the point now, and why I'm posting this here).
Every review (user review AND media review) of FIFA 19 absolutely pulls it to pieces. Rightly, IMO. But...
The first link for me if I Google "FIFA 19 review" is this one. If you haven't read this, please, spend five minutes reading this:
Bleacher Report: FIFA 19 Re-Review, and How EA Broke Its Promising Game
It's astonishing. Brilliant article, great insight. Especially when it talks about the game becoming much more about exploits than solid gameplay.
But what really gets me... Remember when @Matt10 was talking about how good the FIFA 20 beta was? (I experienced it - it REALLY WAS.) Along with Operation Sports, and the presentation they saw that showed how committed to realism they were? Then, between beta and final... The game turned to absolute shit? And now, we get monthly updates to fix FUT moans, and half the time they're rushed and break other parts of the game?
It all started with FIFA 19. Check out this article, seriously. It's like the blueprint.
Playing FIFA 18 and feeling how much slower, more difficult to exploit and generally more realistic it is in terms of a representation of football (IMO) - which is driven by gameplay changes not being made instantly for FUT whiners, and by the vision not deviating wildly from the original vision... I just feel like the path of the modern games is so wrong.
I've chosen FIFA 18 over other games the past 7-8 months now,started during 19 and kept going when 20 was released.
Still enjoy it,only downside for me playing outside the EPL is a lack of stadiums Vs 19/20.
Still take it over the past two games though
I have 15-20 installed,and I honestly feel that 17/18 plays the best (I know a lot of people prefer 16).I re-installed '18 as I remember I enjoyed it a while ago. You were not kidding when you said it played slow. I actually feel it plays slower than '16. I dont know why '19 and '20 just dont connect with me..
The old games have something special I dont know what it is... 20 and 19 feel sometimes like im trying to hard to think "hey I like this". I've installed so many fifa games these days and some just click.
It was great for me, UP UNTIL I got Germany in the semis. Suddenly the game speed doubled (movement speed and pass speed), and I was heartbroken. Up to this point I had a lot of 0-0s. Suddenly I just had to watch Germany score at will - but... At least it's difficult. For me.I decided to try FIFA 18 WC again after reading Chris' post.
I beat Tunisia 2-1, and for the first time in a year, I actually enjoyed playing FIFA again.
Not sure if it was just a Placebo effect, but the game plays so much better than 20.
I will finish my WC tournament this weekend, but after one game I really enjoyed it.
...and then they go and multiply the speed values by 2 to "make it fun"... What the fuck, man.
so you think underneath the frostbite engine theres a better game? Better thatn those in the ignite? I’ve read beta gameplay of 18 and 20 were great, but better than pre patched 16 or 14? Its interesting bc people want a new engine but whats the point if it will be aimed at non sim gameplay.
100% IMO. I am a big fan of 16 but having recently started playing 17 again, I can say without a doubt, it is my favorite Fifa of all time. The size of the ball is my only complaint but I can live with that. Cpu fouls, crosses and headers are a threat and not nerfed, AI defenders who actually seem to care about defending. No tiki taka from Cpu or very little of it, dribbling is good also.so you think underneath the frostbite engine theres a better game? Better thatn those in the ignite? I’ve read beta gameplay of 18 and 20 were great, but better than pre patched 16 or 14? Its interesting bc people want a new engine but whats the point if it will be aimed at non sim gameplay.
There are two modern FIFA's I've managed to play 3+ seasons in - 17 and 19. Didn't even manage that with 16.100% IMO. I am a big fan of 16 but having recently started playing 17 again, I can say without a doubt, it is my favorite Fifa of all time. The size of the ball is my only complaint but I can live with that. Cpu fouls, crosses and headers are a threat and not nerfed, AI defenders who actually seem to care about defending. No tiki taka from Cpu or very little of it, dribbling is good also.
100% IMO. I am a big fan of 16 but having recently started playing 17 again, I can say without a doubt, it is my favorite Fifa of all time. The size of the ball is my only complaint but I can live with that. Cpu fouls, crosses and headers are a threat and not nerfed, AI defenders who actually seem to care about defending. No tiki taka from Cpu or very little of it, dribbling is good also.
Last week did the same. Deleted 18 & 19 due to disk capacity. After due to collectors addiction i have, i finally deleted SW Batllefront and reinstalled 18 cause of WC2018 dlc and 2019 cause of Women WC2019, although i never play women mode. Just for the shake of collection.Oh I agree, I currently have 16 and 17 installed. I deleted 18-20. There is something special about the ignite engine tho, some sort of freedom or to me the ball seems a more separate entity than in frostbite. There are ocurrences of randomness that I havent experienced in frostbite. It does have its problems tho, its not perfect. Currently have a CM in each.
I wrote an essay on this for @fernadez the other day after he asked me a simple question via PM - abridged version below:Havnet played anything for couple weeks but I was enjoying fifa 20 before I stopped.
I played fifa 19 up until around November. As much because I got sick of playing any football game (that's all i play) as it was a problem with fifa.
Are you guys saying fifa 19 with the final patch was better than fifa 20?
Or did it get worse after the november/December patches?
If I go back, should I freeze fifa 19 in time where it is, or fully update it?
(I'm downloading the fifa 18 demo too. Dont remember much about it, not even the teams.
I do remember the fifa 17 demo though. The first frostbite. Remember thinking the ball felt so nice and soft...sounds a bit weird written like that)
I wrote an essay on this for @fernadez the other day after he asked me a simple question via PM - abridged version below:
With the coronavirus situation (and going insane), I've taken the opportunity to install every PES and FIFA I've ever had (for the umpteenth time in the last few years), which is a mental illness in itself...
A week or two ago, I was re-reading the FIFA 16 to 20 threads from when each demo was released, to see A) how I felt about them at release (to see if my opinion had changed), and B) what everyone else thought at the time, in order to try the "best bits" of FIFA.
Reading those old posts of mine, I was amazed. From the start I liked 16 and 17, didn't like 18, LOVED 19 until a patch sped it up, and 20 I've pretty much hated from the start. I give up with 20 now - I've been using the Frosty editor to rebuild the physics and make the game more tactical, and after 2-3 weeks of trying to make the ball less tennis-ball-like and make it more difficult to rely on the exact same moves over and over... I give up.
20 is a big problem. You can't fix the fact that they've so clearly moved the game towards "arcade" than ever - speeding everything up and turning defenders into a foosball-table perfect line of static morons, for online players to have to constantly micro-manage. It's honestly the worst FIFA of the decade IMO.
But to go back to the start...
FIFA 16 is very good, but I just can't love it. I don't like how the AI only plays one way, it's a bit stiff, and I don't love the physics (I know they're good, but they're not as free or expansive as the modern games, in my opinion). Honestly, I just find it a bit dull.
FIFA 17's gameplay was a tiny bit better, in my (unpopular) opinion, even though it was Frostbite. It was pretty buggy - and the AI was even more basic. Going back to it, there's a lack of responsiveness in certain circumstances too. But, the ball felt more free, headers were allowed, and tiki-taka wasn't as mad.
FIFA 18 is weird. It's the start of the engine getting more erratic, in my opinion. I was enjoying the World Cup add-on, even though almost every group game was a grind, 0-0s and 1-0s (which I prefer to silly scores). Then, I was up against Germany, and it was horrendous. Gameplay was 100% faster, the AI resorted to tiki-taka, and I just turned it off at half time.
FIFA 19, though... It turns out that if I go back to those old forum posts, I still feel the same. My feelings haven't changed at all. Which tells me that the games are actually getting worse, rather than my tastes are changing...
In September-time, I made some posts (and @fernadez too) talking about the dribbling, and how on normal speed (in the demo) the animation felt odd because there were so many corrective touches on the ball - but on slow speed in the release version it felt natural, because you could see each touch and it was (at the time) mind-blowing to dribble so fluently with the left stick alone.
But then patch after patch started ruining different things in order to try and fix FUT/eSports moaners. The original release is better, BUT unfortunately it's got some career-ruining bugs and really, you need the patches.
Honestly, I still really like it with the patches - but you also have to accept the worst bits:
- The league table is always silly (the league winners draw half their games).
- Your opponents play a severely weakened team against you way too often.
- There are barely any fouls.
- The biggie - most find the game much too easy versus the AI.
The good news? Paulv2k4's patches on PC (the career one, and the gameplay one) fix all of that.
It is UNBELIEVABLE to me how much better it feels than 20 (primarily because of its braindead defenders). So it's 19 for me, for the time being.