Hoffenheim article in The Observer

miguel.

International
29 March 2004
Portugal
SL Benfica
German village heroes
European football has never seen anything like it - a village team on course for the Champions League. Meet the men behind the amazing story of TSG 1899 Hoffenheim

North Ferriby, population 3,800, is a picturesque Humberside village with a school, a pub, a British Legion club, a fish-and-chip shop, and a football team who punch above their weight. North Ferriby United play in the premier division of the Unibond League. They have won the East Riding Cup 13 times and once reached the third qualifying round of the FA Cup. Not so long ago they moved up to the seventh level of English football, and they went into the weekend seventh in the Unibond table. Their average home crowd, before yesterday's game against FC United of Manchester, was 211.

Imagine if North Ferriby were to have risen a further six levels and, instead of playing FC United, they were hosting Manchester United. And at the halfway stage of their debut season at the top level, they were top of the Premier League, with United, Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal in their wake.

If that sounds ridiculous and impossible in equal measure, it is what is happening in Germany. Hoffenheim, a village in the south-west of the country and about the same size as North Ferriby, give or take 50 souls, were playing at the same level as the Humberside club, the eighth tier, at the start of the 1990s. If they draw or win today, at home to Schalke, Hoffenheim will go into the winter break top of the Bundesliga. There are many hoping they do not: fans of bigger clubs who cannot abide the thought of these village upstarts leading the way.

It is a freezing cold winter's day when Observer Sport visits Hoffenheim. There is a baker, a coffee shop, a barber, a couple of bars and, beyond the silent lanes and well kept timbered houses, the lightly frosted Baden-Württemberg countryside. And there is TSG 1899 Hoffenheim.

The club have 2,000 members yet their temporary home, capacity 26,300, and the new stadium due to open in January (30,000) will be sold out for all remaining games this season. In the baker's, shop assistant Tamara Weitz says: 'I've been a fan all my life and my father and sister have a season ticket. The Hoffenheim players eat our bread but not so much the cake.'

Until 1992, Hoffenheim were an amateur club playing in the Kreisliga A, whose English equivalent is the lesser divisions of the Unibond League, the British Gas League and the Ryman League. Their rise up the divisions - surely the most remarkable anywhere in world football - is a result of investment by a local man who played more than 200 games for Hoffenheim. It started in 1990 when Dietmar Hopp, who according to a recently published list is the world's 698th richest person, began putting money into a trust for the club. So far he has pumped in more than €150m (£133m).

Hoffenheim worked their way up the ladder, and back-to-back promotions took them into Bundesliga I last summer. Now, 18 years since Hopp's arrival, his club show no sign of heading back in the other direction and are building a new home fit for kings. A point today will earn them the title of Herbstmeister - halfway champions.

The average age of the first team is under 23. They play exciting, attacking football under the leadership of head coach Ralf Rangnick, an anglophile who is a great admirer, and friend, of Arsène Wenger.

'It would be an absolute sensation if we do this,' says Rangnick, when asked if Hoffenheim can actually win the Bundesliga and create a chapter in modern sport that would surely be incomparable.

Their rise is a tale that has caused bitter jealousy from rival supporters. 'There's a lot of hatred because a lot of them think our success is just down to money,' Hopp says. 'The fact is, however, I've invested five times as much money in the infrastructure - youth-development centres, playing fields, the stadium, and training centre - as I have in the professional football team.' Abuse aimed at Hopp includes incessant chanting over his parentage and, as at a recent game against Borussia Dortmund, seeing an image of his head as a target.

On this particular morning, Rangnick's squad are unable to train on the frozen five a-side pitch next to the small, temporary building that acts as the club's press office. Instead, the players drive up the hill to the now disused Dietmar Hopp Stadion - home matches are played at Mannheim until next month's move to the Rhein-Neckar Arena in nearby Sinsheim - so they can take advantage of the under-soil heating. Supporters and media wander in as the players walk over the grass to a dugout where they change from training shoes into football boots.

Wayne Rooney, Frank Lampard, Steven Gerrard and John Terry probably last had to change in the bitter cold like this when playing in Sunday youth football. Yet the squad that heads one of Europe's powerhouse leagues could hardly care less.

Seriously rich men owning and controlling clubs are commonplace but, unlike the billionaire foreigners in the Premier League, Hopp is the local boy who played many times for his beloved team. 'Ever since I was young, I've been a keen player,' says the 68-year-old, whose fortune from the software firm he co-founded in 1972 is about €1bn. 'At 14 I started playing in the youth team. At 17, I was given special medical permission to play in the first team - back then, the football association only allowed players under 18 to play if a doctor confirmed that there was no medical reason why they shouldn't. I don't know exactly, but I'd say I played more than 200 games. I always really enjoyed it. And when I was at university in Karlsruhe I was selected for the first team.

'I grew up in Hoffenheim and have always maintained a strong connection to the place. In 1990, the success of SAP [the software company] enabled me to start providing financial support. At that time, the club was playing in the local community league and I mainly helped the youth teams.'

In 2005 Hopp came close to merging Hoffenheim with two other local clubs and basing the new team in nearby Heidelberg. Local planners were against the idea, though. 'So we built the stadium in Sinsheim,' Hopp says, 'and to our surprise we have still gained a great number of supporters. That is due in no small part to the fact that we see ourselves as the club for the whole of the Rhein-Neckar metropolitan region. Of course, our team's very attractive and entertaining playing style has also won us a lot of fans.'

In 2006 Hopp made the final push by recruiting Rangnick, a former Schalke, Hannover and VfB Stuttgart coach, who needed four weeks 'and another 24 hours' to make the decision to work in the third division, a level he had left behind 12 years earlier.

'Mr Hopp had been trying to win promotion [from the third division] for three or four years with no success,' says Rangnick, a bespectacled 50-year-old who managed Schalke in the Champions League four seasons ago and, like Wenger, is nicknamed 'the professor'. 'At that time he was still putting money in, but not as much as now. What he had been trying to do was the same as many clubs - bring in experienced, expensive players. He was looking for a big solution. I told him that we wanted to look for younger players from the start.

'We realised after two or three months that we needed Francisco Copado [a 34-year-old midfielder] and other older players. After the promotion to league two we said, "Now we completely concentrate on the younger ones." We only looked for players aged between 17 and 23. The oldest we've signed in the last three years was Per Nilsson [a Swedish defender]. He was 24. All the others we signed were 19, 20, 21.'

In all, around €20m was spent last season, an investment that Rangnick felt no need to match this summer, such was his confidence in his players' ability.

'With those youngsters you have to let them run. If you play defensively with a young team it is a contradiction. Young players have many advantages. They learn faster, listen, can cope with the intensity of training. Young players also know that they need team spirit, and need trust and confidence from us.

'The average age of the squad is 22-and-a-half. We have only four defeats, which is absolutely unbelievable. The progress in recent months is outstanding.'

Among those recruited was 23-year-old defender Marvin Compper, who became Hoffenheim's first Germany international when making his debut against England in October. There is also the Bundesliga's top scorer, Vedad Ibisevic, a 24-year-old Bosnia striker with 18 goals so far. Chinedu Obasi, a 22-year-old Nigerian, is challenging Bayern Munich's Franck Ribéry to be considered this season's best performer in the Bundesliga.

'It was a tough decision,' Obasi says of his move from Lyn Oslo in Norway, where he had played with his best friend, Chelsea's John Obi Mikel. 'I'd never heard of Hoffenheim. When I got a call and they were in the second division in Germany it was difficult because my agent wasn't really buying the idea,' he says referring to John Shittu, who also represents Mikel. 'But the trainer told me what the team wanted to achieve, and I wanted to be part of it.'

Hoffenheim have improved throughout the season. They are top scorers with 41 goals - four more than champions Bayern, to whom Hoffenheim were unlucky 2-1 losers in a memorable match in Munich last week. The Bayern line-up featured Ribéry, Champions League winner Marc van Bommel, and Luca Toni, who won the last World Cup with Italy. Hoffenheim also have the second best defensive record, with 22 conceded.

Asked to explain the club's performance, Rangnick laughs modestly and names four key areas: the primacy of young players, a long-term vision, an emphasis on man-management and his role as the sole leader of the club.

'We wanted to build success, win promotion in the next one to four years, and have a team with the quality to play in the first division. Also, senior players like Copado and Selim Teber [who captained the team into Bundesliga 2] may have been overhauled by the young players, but they are still important emotionally. Leading the team emotionally is key, rather than just giving commandments. I've been with Arsenal twice - two-and-a-half and four years ago - in their pre-season training camp in Austria. There you could see Arsène. Of course he's the boss. But there are staff around who give his players the chance to develop.

'Finally, it's a different system here than in England where, in the big clubs at least, the manager is strong. In Germany you have the head coach, but also at least two other strong figures. It is only us and maybe Wolfsburg, with Felix Magath, who have the manager system.'

Rangnick is an anglophile who when studying English, which he wanted to teach, spent a year at Sussex University. He lived in Lewes and played for Southwick in the Sussex County League. 'I was a defensive midfielder. My first game was Chichester away. I was one-on-one with the goalkeeper and was sure it was a goal. But a tackle from behind put me in hospital for four weeks. I had broken three ribs and perforated a lung. It was a serious injury, what might happen in a car accident. But it was normal - what we called the English physical game!'

Hopp, who Rangnick says visits the dressing room only after victory and never interferes in team matters, also remembers his early playing days. In his first game for Hoffenheim's youth team he forgot his shorts. 'I had to play in normal trousers. After the first sliding tackle, they were so torn they flapped about like a skirt. But I still managed to score the goal that took us to the final score of 1-1.'

His hopes for this season have changed as Rangnick and his team continue to astound. 'Our goal was simply to avoid relegation,' Hopp says. 'But we've become more ambitious, although I would be happy if we were in the top eight.'

He conceded that he cannot continue indefinitely to support the club and Rangnick understands the importance of stabilising their position. 'In the last two years it was very much because of Mr Hopp, and the club's future still depends on him. Should we qualify for Europe, whether it be Champions League or Uefa Cup, it'll be difficult to stay there over the next three or four years. And, to keep our players and bring in new ones, I still strongly believe we need him.'

Hopp is passionate about Hoffenheim and appears unlikely to walk away soon. There is an element of co-dependency in the relationship between owner and club, because of the Bundesliga rule that members own 51 per cent of a club. Hopp's deal is 'essentially based on trust. The investments I've made, the loans, are not guaranteed. But as long as the team continues to do well this is not something I need to worry about. I own the stadium and the training centre, both of which are rented by the club at a good market rate.'

Can he imagine other German clubs following his example? 'I don't think it would happen again in the same way. I've known all the officials at TSG 1899 since I was a boy. That's why it's not a problem for me that an investor can't become the majority shareholder in a football club. I don't think I've set any precedents here.'

Does Rangnick believe the ownership structure stops German success in the Champions League? Seven years have passed since the trophy was claimed by Bayern Munich, who find themselves in the Uefa Cup this season.

'We have this discussion if we should get rid of the 51 per cent rule. But many of the traditionalists are afraid to have a situation like Manchester City, where a sheikh comes and buys Borussia Dortmund or Bayern,' says Rangnick. 'On the other hand I think everybody would love to have somebody like Dietmar Hopp with the same ambitions as the club.

'It's possible, but the gap between the big clubs of Europe and ours is getting wider. There is so much TV money in other countries, and some also have better tax breaks for players. Then there is the additional money from Abramovich, the sheikhs or whoever, so players can earn in one week what ours do in a month. It's difficult to attract top players and keep them.

'The only chance we have here is to build young players like we do in Hoffenheim. But it sounds good, doesn't it? Hoffenheim against Arsenal or Manchester United in the Champions League.'

It would, as Rangnick says, be a sensation. And it will not be happening in North Ferriby.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/dec/14/bundesliga-football-hoffenheim

Very, very interesting read.
 
maybe better in the bundesliga thread?

scum does not deserve an own topic. :p ;)

and no, it would not be a sensation seeing how much money is behind this.
 
Erm what players have the bought with that money?

They have shown how to use money properly to ensure the future of a club at the highest levels. Its not just a plaything that he will get bored of.
 
Erm what players have the bought with that money?

They have shown how to use money properly to ensure the future of a club at the highest levels. Its not just a plaything that he will get bored of.

Well said.

They made their first "popular" transfer last week. And that's Hildebrand. :THINK:

I heard that they are going to build a new stadium, right?
 
8,5 mio for carlos eduardo as a 2nd bundesliga team is not a big transfer? or 4,5 mio for a not very well known player like wellington?

i am not getting into this as most of you guys have teams in leagues that are used to big investors and shit like that. we over here are not. and i can't really express how much i hate them in a 2nd language i do not use on a daily base. and i personally hate to see that stupid assclown of a club taking the spot in the bundesliga that would be much better filled with a big club with tradition, a big name and lots of fans. and that's not just my opinion. :)
 
Errr..guys, I think someone like OPM, who knows German football well, will know better about Hoffenheim than our cruddy media or any of ourselves, so let's not get ahead of ourselves... ;)
 
While it's nice to see investment in a team, I hoped he would have put it into the Eastern teams, the big cities in the East (Leipzig, Dresden, Chemnitz) have no teams near the top tiers of the league and even teams like Hansa Rostock and Energie Cottbus can only stay in the Bundesliga for 1-2 years then they cannot compete with the money side of the game.

Even Berlin, the largest city in Germany, and the largest city in Europe to only have one top team. If he had put the money into a team like Union Berlin, TeBe or Berliner Dynamo I think it would have made the Bundesliga greater.
 
8,5 mio for carlos eduardo as a 2nd bundesliga team is not a big transfer? or 4,5 mio for a not very well known player like wellington?

i am not getting into this as most of you guys have teams in leagues that are used to big investors and shit like that. we over here are not. and i can't really express how much i hate them in a 2nd language i do not use on a daily base. and i personally hate to see that stupid assclown of a club taking the spot in the bundesliga that would be much better filled with a big club with tradition, a big name and lots of fans. and that's not just my opinion. :)

I think Offenheim are a great thing for football in general and particularly for German football which already has the image of the most boring in the world (and i do not agree with that...). From what i've seen, they play spectacular and offensive football...

I think it's great that a litle club (with big money) starts spoiling things for the usual favourites like Bayern Munchen, Bayern Munchen, Bayern Munchen and Bayern Munchen...Everybody complains that trhoughout Europe the same 10 or 12 clubs divide all the silverware between them (the English big four, Milan, Inter and Juve, Lyon, Real Madrid and Barcelona, Bayern and somtimes Werder) and when there is a new player on the field, they are hated....(cfr. Chelsea). I think football needs dozens of other Offenheims...

I think you should have been glad if that guy would have spend his money on Nuremberg. Instead of doing that or investing in more obvious clubs like Bayern or Werder or Dortmund he put his money in his local club where he once played himself, i have rarely seen a bigger sign of loyalty and acting in the true spirit of football...

Offenheim for champions !!!! (But in the end they will loose against Bayern).
 
Errr..guys, I think someone like OPM, who knows German football well, will know better about Hoffenheim than our cruddy media or any of ourselves, so let's not get ahead of ourselves... ;)

I'm German and know my ways around my home countries football leagues, too. And I absolutely support Hopp and his ways.

You'll find a fair share of people who have neutral, positive and negative points of view about Hoffenheim in Germany.

Most fans of clubs with tradition which are notorious underachievers you will see complain, cause there are glory times ahead of this little "artificial" club. Times the likes many former "big guns" drift further and further away from.
 
You'll find a fair share of people who have neutral, positive and negative points of view about Hoffenheim in Germany.

Of course, you can find lots of them. But that's hardly surprising given the huge media propaganda this "club" is getting.

German sports media is sucking up to Mr. Hopp and his little project like you wouldn't believe it. Their success is helping in selling magazines and newspapers, getting them all the support they could wish for.

Heck, the media even supports their fairytale about most of their players being recruited from their own youth-squad. If anybody ever wondered if you can buy success in football - This is the proof.

This team does hardly belong in the third division. Them playing Championsleague? A disgrace....
 
I do not "follow" an opinion at all. It's my own and dare I say that I was skeptical at first!?
On every newspaper article that actually supports Hoffenheim come a dozen that put in question every action of Dietmar Hopp and whomever has a say there. That's the way it goes with most all of the football clubs in the spotlight in Germany. Media sucks - thus far I can agree.

Hoffenheim a disgrace for the Champions League? I highly doubt it. If Hoffenheim really outperforms 15 other teams in our highest division, they damn sure deserve to be in there.
 
Hoffenheim a disgrace for the Champions League? I highly doubt it. If Hoffenheim really outperforms 15 other teams in our highest division, they damn sure deserve to be in there.

Their success is no surprise given the money put into this project.

And do you really think they deserve to be on the same page with teams such as Real Madrid, Manchester United and AC Milan?

99% of their fans didn't even knew this club existed two years ago. It's all just one big media hype, no tradition at all. They even changed their name to incorporate the "1899" to fool people into believing they have some sort of respectable past.

Until Hopp started pouring money in, this club was nothing and would have never even reached the fourth division. And now they take up a Championsleague spot from a well-known club with actual fans and a heart and soul....ughh!
 
Well, someone needs to do something as their make-believe starts to spread internationally already. :BLINK: :SMUG:

I think you are jealous because Dortmund are has beens....just like most fans who come from traditional (failing) clubs are jealous or at least envious (which is their right of course).

And maybe it's also the media but in the nineties when Dortmund was very succesfull, wasn't that due to money (over-investing)...

The traditionsverein's fans are not very objective.
On the one hand they are mad or frustrated because Offenheim is the new big club, on the other hand the club that is maybe the biggest traditionsverein in Germany (Schalke 04) is the laughing stock because they never win silverware and fail...

Same in Italy with Parma and Inter Milan a couple of years ago...
Same in England with Chelsea and Spurs...

Time will tell if Offenheim will be a lasting club and if all the money Hopp pours into the club is a good thing...just like now people can come to conclusions about the golden nineties of Dortmund...was it all worthwile the (over)investment ??? (and that is something that i want to judge...Dortmund's fans should be the judge of that, just like Offenheim's fans....you get my clue ????).

And lastly, every succes in football is due to miney, that is the case for Offenheim just like it is the case for every other succesfull club in Europe...

I sincerely hope that Offenheim will play the Champions League and may win it. Football needs new big clubs...change is good for sports...
 
I´m not jealous because of their success, you really think that fans of traditional clubs would want to trade in their history and passion for some titles?

It's not about them being successful. I really don't like Bayern Munich at all, but I can respect them. They´re Germany's team to beat and they earned that position over the past 25 years. But they earned it fair and square and made their way to the top without such big funding.

You´re right, Borussia Dortmund spent lots of money on their squad during the mid-ninties. But the club was successful and known before, it just happened to be their time due to clever (which later turned ugly...) management. The club had, at no point, unlimited funding like Hoffenheim is having now.

And I disagree about football needing new clubs. There's lots of clubs, some of them stay top class all the time, others go up and down. But nobody needs fake plastic clubs like Hoffenheim, they´re nothing but toys for wealthy men that want to take Football Manger to real life..
 
Why is Offenheim "fake".
And Bayern Munchen used to be a litle club too...
All big clubs were once litle.
Some litle clubs (Blackpool, Dukla Praha, Pro Vercelli, Nuremberg,...) were once big clubs...
What you want is a status quo forever...Carthago and Troy were once among the biggest cities in the world, now they are ruïns...that is called evolution. If there was n evolution with would still all be monkeys now...

And you say Offenheim is Dietmar Hopp's toy...don't you think Milan is Berlusconi's toy, just like napoli is De Laurentis' toy and Inter is Moratti's toy and what about the English clubs like Man Utd (Glazer's toy), Man City (Abu Dabi's sheik's toy), Aston Villa (Randy Lerner), Chelsea (the most obvious one but not more a toy than Man Utd)...

And be honest, wouldn't everybody do the same as Hopp ??? I certainly would if i had the money...and then it's a case of doing the obvious like Berlusconi and Glazier, or doing something in the true spirit of football, making a big club of your boyhood club...i think Offenheim's story is far more than a simple toy's story...i think it's a football fairy tale...i don't know Hopp, i don't know Offenheim (Schalke is my team in Germany) but i really love their story...it's great for football and i hope there will be lots of other Offenheim's...i'm utterly bored with the predictability of the CL...i want new teams..surprises...fair competition (within realistic limits, that is to say that money will always be important...). With Offenheim and Hopp's money, Bayern Munchen have for the first time since Werder and HSV a serious challenger...you would be delighted if it was Dortmund. But with the arrival of Offenheim Dortmund are further down the pecking order and that is your problem.

Oh and money can't buy it all (but it obviously helps a lot): look at Hearts of Midlothian in Scotland. They also have a sugar daddy but they did not succeed... (one can even say that uptil now for Chelsea too)...
 
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You have a weird perspective of football then. Sorry, but it would kill me to see my club being taken over by some wealthy billionaire. And again, don't compare them to Bayern Munich. Yes, they were small once but they made their way to the top alone. Without help from a billionaire.

It may be normal in the Premier League now but it certainly isn't in Germany. And I don't see what makes putting tons of money into a club a fairytale. They bought success like no other club in the German Bundesliga. What's magical about that?

I´m sad to see that many people are falling for this, seems like most people don't even care about football as a sport but see it as some kind of entertainment industry.

Stuff like that will kill football as we know it one day. But by then, the fans of Hoffenheim will have moved on to the next "big thing" anyways, whatever that will be.
 
How is it a football manger dream? What superstars has he bought ffs?

The majority of their players are from their youth academy that has had the money invested in their facillities and scouting network.
 
How is it a football manger dream? What superstars has he bought ffs?

The majority of their players are from their youth academy that has had the money invested in their facillities and scouting network.

They already spent millions on players when they were in the second division. They haven't bought any internationals yet but the team consists of many players that even other Bundesliga clubs could not afford.


Check out their list of players and feast your eyes on the many squad members coming from their youth academy:

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/1899_Hoffenheim#Aktueller_Profikader
 
While it is true that they haven't exactly much players coming from their youth academy, peter Eyres is right that they haven't bought superstars...i remember that they bought one of their forwards here in Belgium from the big and mighty Mouscron (Ba)...this is not an obvious player to buy...i've bee nwatching your wiki-link...and now i'm even more impressed. They bought players from clubs like Mouscron elsewhere (Denizlispor, Asante kotoko, Alemania Aachen). in fact Hildebrand is their only high profile buyer.
Furthermore i agree with you that money has changed everything. I don't like it a bit, but let's be honest you can't stop that. If some billionaire from my village who has played for my village team, would be so genrous to give that amount of money for my village club, i would become a fan immediately...
Would i be a glory hunter ???? Well maybe, but clubs like Man Utd, Liverpool, Barcelona, Real Madrid, AC Milan atract millions of glory hunters, so what's wrong it clubs like Offenheim attract a few thousand new fans ????
I respect the fact that you don't like Offenheim, but don't try to justify it...there is no justification possible and there isn't even one needed. You have the right to dislike football clubs without justification...
While i do not agree with you, it's nice to discuss this with you...furthermore i think Offenhiem's success will be short term...in a year or 10 Offenheim will be forgotten (although i hope that they can become an established big club, just like dozens of other clubs that are litle now).
 
The only player I've heard of before this season is Wellington and he's not exactly a superstar. Okay not many from their own youth academy, but they are hardly Chelsea.
 
And there is nothing wrong with Chelsea either...Roman is a good thing for football although i'm not sure that Roman is a good thing for Chelsea in the long term...
 
Thing is: You can't compare the business of the present with that in the past. The now "big guns" were lucky they've made it big in a time were money wasn't the quintessence of football - During the 60's or even earlier -. It was like it is today: hard work. Just on mostly other terrain. Nowadays a big club just buys top class players whenever in need. That wasn't the usual procedure way back in the prosperous days especially in the Bundesliga.

Following your logic, Montoya, there would NEVER EVER be a "new" top club emerging to the highest stages of world football, because they'd never even have the chance to come close to them in terms of finances.

And yes, the sports club we now know as 1899 Hoffenheim was indeed founded in 1899. Just because they were a small club most of the time does not mean they do not have any history. Hell, I come from a small town myself, but our "petty little" football clubs have more tradition and history than quite some of the professional teams in the higher leagues. Who are you to tell when tradition becomes "worthy"?
And that's exactly the point I try to get across: NOBODY would start discussions like that if Hopp would've pumped up the club 20 years ago. Just like nobody will care IN 20 years, because by then they will have gathered some real tradition, won't they?

It all has to start somewhere. Always.

Last thing is a repeat: Hopp is no Abramovich. Hopp is not insane.
 
I think Hoffenheim is the best thing which could happened to german football. I saw most of their games in the first half season and I have to say that they definetliy played the best football and that not only with expensive international players like carlos eduardo, demba ba or chndu obasi as everyone expect, but also with young talented (carlos eduardo, demba ba or chndu obasi are also talented) german player like timo weiß or marvin compper which also shows their call up in the german national team. Another example is that their goalgetter Ibisevic (18 goals in 17 games) was an nearly unknown player in german football when they get him a few years ago and now he's an aspirante for the the best scorrer in europe...
And no, Dietmar Hopp isn't another Abramowitch because Hoffenheim is his homeclub and he also supported him when they were a stranger in Germany.
Hopefully, can they make the step in the Championsleague.
 
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