PES6 Vs FIFA07

kgulls said:
The joke of it is,I've stood on the terraces and watched my beloved Torquay scrape a 0-0 draw with Shrewsbury today and that was nothing like proper football either.If the game had been on the 360 I,d have taken it back and come on the forums saying how the passing was crap, shots ballooned over the bar,unrealistically,players refusing to make runs,dodgy defending.Hey,does this sound familiar.Lol.
Seriously though Jack.It worries and frustrates me how we,the gaming public, are now so in the pocket of the only two real players in the football gaming industry.Between them, Konami and EA can drip feed us for the forseeable life of the 360 and PS3.There is no viable monetry value in making a great game in the first years of a new format.If you do; what then?So we have to put up with what is offered.No choice.
Then,of course, they also have the clever ploy of enhancement via the marketplace.Lets keep some of the things back that we could have put in the game and release them later,making us seem jolly good fellows.Again,no choice.
Seems like its not only the AI thats being tweaked by the game makers.Joe public is being tweaked for sure.
Sorry folks.Very cynical post
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Kgulls I have no problem with shots going over the bar or dodgy passes and crap runs, I would just like it to happen when I ask, I love the fact that FIFA, at least on the PS2 and Xbox gave us the chance to play with the lower league teams and have some good old scraps, I prefer this to playing with the all stars. I love having to grind out results and actually have to change tactics to suit the teams you play etc.

I've been saying the things about the choking effect Konami and EA are having on the football game scene for a long time, and your post is far more truth than cynical unfortunately.

Nobody wants to bring out a product with any kind of longevity anymore, certainly not Konami or EA and until someone new brings out a football game that surpasses both, nothing will change ...
 
Okay.So tomorrow I connect my 360 and I have both games.The bulk of my gaming time will be spent on my own playing single player,not online.I have played WE/PES for years and played the latest FIFA07 on PS2 so know how both have played on those consoles.My question is which game to play first.Bear in mind its a level playing field with an open mind on how the game plays plus I have never played a football game with an xbox controller.Which game do you feel is easiest to get into given the shortcomings of both.Has anybody played both and found they could'nt decide which was better.
 
FIFA is easier to pick-up-and-play I'd say, but PES plays a better overall game after you give it some time to get used to its style. How come you're waiting to tomorrow to connect it and not tonight?
 
Nick Cave said:
Kgulls I have no problem with shots going over the bar or dodgy passes and crap runs, I would just like it to happen when I ask, I love the fact that FIFA, at least on the PS2 and Xbox gave us the chance to play with the lower league teams and have some good old scraps, I prefer this to playing with the all stars. I love having to grind out results and actually have to change tactics to suit the teams you play etc.

I've been saying the things about the choking effect Konami and EA are having on the football game scene for a long time, and your post is far more truth than cynical unfortunately.

Nobody wants to bring out a product with any kind of longevity anymore, certainly not Konami or EA and until someone new brings out a football game that surpasses both, nothing will change ...
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The bizarre thing is Nick that you would think that with two companies going head to head as they are,our beloved game would push forward in leaps and bounds;but no.Its almost as if there was an unwritten gentlemens agreement to hold back the process of improvement.Fifa with their game engine and Konami with there content.
If EA can regularly churn out a successful Madden game each year without any rival in site,why not football.Maybe it needed a British developer to come to the rescue,but it ai'nt goona happen.
 
^^Snoop^^ said:
FIFA is easier to pick-up-and-play I'd say, but PES plays a better overall game after you give it some time to get used to its style. How come you're waiting to tomorrow to connect it and not tonight?
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1.Too tired!
2.Still talking to you guys and very slow at typing!
3.Frightened I'll not like either!
4.Its like spaghetti junction behind my amp so need daylight to wire it up!
 
well after playing fifa for a while last night and today i went back to pes and it feels really stiff....
 
antred said:
well after playing fifa for a while last night and today i went back to pes and it feels really stiff....
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Jack Bauer said:
Serious question, this isn't an arsey comment but a genuine query; answer this honestly. Don't you find that, when you're going to do a pass, you see where you want it to go and how you want the player to take it in your mind's eye, but then when you press the pass button it either A) goes too slow and the pass recepient just stands there like a dickhead waiting for it, or B) it goes to the wrong person? Or, if you use a through-pass, goes to the side of the player instead of in-front of him?

In FIFA 07 on the 360, I find the passes go where I want them to go (with the fully manual passing system), and the players move their arses to take the ball in their stride and get forward, every time. In PES6, it's so "stiff"; I find that every player seems to stand there as if they're a 43-year-old Sunday league player, going "you expect me to move for that?" - you can't get them to respond - and even then it sometimes goes to the wrong player.

I find no satisfaction scoring in the game when the build-up play was rushed because of the cramped pitches with every opposition player pressing, when most of the passes were sloppy and when the passes were delivered to the wrong man half of the time.

Am I seriously the only one who feels like this?

(I may well be crap at the game, but it wasn't like this in PES5 or WE10)
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Thank God for that, I'm not going mad...
 
Hi guys!

I´ve bought pes6 for the 360 and it feels terrific (I´ve played PES1-6 and WE8-10 with my friends more than anything), I love the pace of the game, it´s perfect. I downloaded the FIFA07 demo (360) and realized that the buttons can´t be customized to my liking (just a couple of preset controll setups), is this possible in the final version?

When playing FIFA07, the AI seems to be really stiff. When I build up an attack, the CPU defence line stands absolutely still in a pixel perfect straight line at about half the pitch. This doesn´t look (or work) to realistic. Is this behaviour the same in the final game? How close is the demo to the final version?

Except for that, FIFA looks and plays really well. I do think the shots and high passes are to fast, it´s far to easy to come one on one with the keeper and it´s far to easy to score, but the game was much better than I thought it would be (I expected it to be crap). The movements of the players are really good and the passing is notch.

Greatful for any answers.

Thanks!

/PS
 
By the sounds of it 07 on the 360 is a completely different animal.

Playing on 07 on the PS2 and Xbox does make you think your playing on a five a side pitch when you go back to P06, I really hope I can get to love F07 because I love having all the leagues in there even if the menu set up is an arse, but it's just the damn delay from pressing to doing... some times it does up to three little animations before anything happens even when the guys just at walking speed.
 
The more I play PES6 the more I'm beginning to like it. And although the pitch doesn't seem as big as FIFA's, PES6 feels quite decent actually. The turning of the players doesn't seem so bad now, the passing seems better than I first thought and I'm getting quite a few powerful shots. I like it :D
 
ekequist said:
When playing FIFA07, the AI seems to be really stiff. When I build up an attack, the CPU defence line stands absolutely still in a pixel perfect straight line at about half the pitch. This doesn´t look (or work) to realistic. Is this behaviour the same in the final game? How close is the demo to the final version?
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To be fair, I cant say ive seen this pixel perfect line in any game ive played yet.

I have hardly touched SP, infact Ive only played 60 mins of it and was losin 2-0 to everton on world class.

Online is where its at, and theres been no lag at all for me. Not a slight judder or anything.

ekequist said:
Except for that, FIFA looks and plays really well. I do think the shots and high passes are to fast, it´s far to easy to come one on one with the keeper and it´s far to easy to score, but the game was much better than I thought it would be (I expected it to be crap). The movements of the players are really good and the passing is notch.
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Also, i was thinking it was to easy to go through 1-1 v the keeper, untill i learned how to spot and defend someone who is gonna try it. You have to keep on your toes with more than 1 controlled player if your gonna intercept it. Positioning is key.

Theres so many types of shots i cant make my mind up about it yet, its friggin hard ill say that. As is the passing, till you realise its not CPU assisted like PES/WE. Thats what makes it orgasmic when doing 1-touch stuff, its hard, but it looks amazing if u pull it off!

EDIT: The orgasmicosity comes from the 1-touch football. Not pulling yourself off. But that helps too.
 
kevano22 said:
To be fair, I cant say ive seen this pixel perfect line in any game ive played yet.

I have hardly touched SP, infact Ive only played 60 mins of it and was losin 2-0 to everton on world class.

Online is where its at, and theres been no lag at all for me. Not a slight judder or anything.



Also, i was thinking it was to easy to go through 1-1 v the keeper, untill i learned how to spot and defend someone who is gonna try it. You have to keep on your toes with more than 1 controlled player if your gonna intercept it. Positioning is key.

Theres so many types of shots i cant make my mind up about it yet, its friggin hard ill say that. As is the passing, till you realise its not CPU assisted like PES/WE. Thats what makes it orgasmic when doing 1-touch stuff, its hard, but it looks amazing if u pull it off!

EDIT: The orgasmicosity comes from the 1-touch football. Not pulling yourself off. But that helps too.
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Thanks for the answer. Can you configure the controller the way you want or is it predefined?

Thanks for your thoughts!
 
You can only choose from two predefined control schemes.

About the one-touch passing; seriously, when I played Kevano, I was gobsmacked (he could probably tell from the "WOAH" I let out) at his movement in the midfield.

You just can't have this amount of control in PES.
 
I bought both games on just about the same day, and I've found myself playing FIFA07 more, despite being so damn excited about PES6.

I think it's because I feel like I've got PES6 "sussed". I loaded it up, and everything was so fucking familiar I felt like I'd fell back into 2005 and just loaded up PES5. I half-expected this even before I'd had a chance to test it out, so from the off my main draw was the XBOX Live ability. I like playing online. And yet... It doesn't work? And, in order to get some chance of it working, I have to try umpteen different, and inconvenient methods to connect with people? Fucking hell...

This brings me to FIFA07. It just felt fresh; like a new challenge for me. Feeling as I did about PES6 I just wanted some sort of change. And people can say what they will about how it's just "dumbed-down football", "not as intricate or intelligent as Pro Evo", "it's way behind", but the bottom line is that i actually have fun playing it. And that's all that really matters to me.

... PLUS it ACTUALLY works online. Better yet, it works very, very well!

Until PES6 iron the creases out of this online fuck-up I think FIFA07 will be the only football game I have in my 360 for a while yet.
 
when playing pes, although a good game i was getting annoyed at the passing. The ball is like its glued to the floor and doesnt bounce. its weird man, i dunno?

And the pitch being so small....
 
kgulls said:
Its almost as if there was an unwritten gentlemens agreement to hold back the process of improvement.Fifa with their game engine and Konami with there content.
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Actually its a commonly used financial/economic theory. it goes along the lines of "Why both go for one element and cancel each other out when you can both aim for something different and both have a good piece of the pie". Its more based on customers then development but it remains intact when viewed from a different angle, why risk upsetting the balance of sales by drastically improving (which creates a cycle of increasing development costs to improve beyond the competitor) when you can both potter along with minimal development/costs and both have good financial results at the end of each release. Sad, but true. FIFA07 shows this very clearly imo, they have invested a lot for the nextgen, after gradually losing marketshare to nokami in the currentgen and next year will probably be the same. Nokami will make a new game which will form the base, as fifa07 will aswell and then they will continue in the same vain with incremental upgrades.
 
Bought all three games at the w/e...pro evo (360 + PS2) and fifa 07 (360). Without a doubt for me the ps2 version of pro evo just pips the 360 version with fifa still someway short of both games. Despite good reviews it still played like a fifa game and I'm quite surprised how many former pro evo devotees have turned to it. I'd def. rent before you buy if you are thinking of buying it chaps.

Obviously just my opinion but still pro evo for me despite the ridiculous fact half the game is missing in the 360 version.
 
i feel that the 360 pro isn't slow compared to the ps2 version just more weighted making the game more physical therefore the game is more of a battle
 
hbk101 said:
i feel that the 360 pro isn't slow compared to the ps2 version just more weighted making the game more physical therefore the game is more of a battle
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Has anyone tried playing 4:3 aspect ratio instead of widescreen(pes 6)

Jesus,Its like they are all on speed.

Its like twice the speed of pes 5.

Played one game like that,then had to lie down in a dark room for a while...
 
im glad i'm not the only one who thinks that FIFA is better than pes this round.

Few things I've noticed.

PENALTIES! im so fed up of the terrible penalties on pro evo
fifa actually has come up with a decent penalty method. the addition of a power bar for shots makes a massive difference, it adds a whole lot more skill to taking penalties rather than 'pot luck' pro evo penalties

Diagonal Passing - pro evo seems to be stuck to its 8-way 45degree angle passes. due to the poor engine you cant put a pass where you want it. beckham style passes over the top, and long seeking diagonal passes are more possible in fifa. in pro evo, i always found that if you tried a long chipped pass the defender would ALWAYS head away. it'd never go over his head. its just unrealistic. i've found on a few occasions already that even goal kicks can be miss judged by the defenders, leaving the striker through on goal

Off the ball Movement - this has been a big criticism of mine when it came to pro evo. at least with fifa, they try different thigns to improve it. ie if you're sitting there with carrick in the centre circle, in pro evo, the strikers wait for the pass, then run... where as fifa, you can pull the left trigger, and someone runs into space, then you can pick them out with a nicely weighted pass. it feels more like football instead of robotic ball movement.

Shooting - Again, due to the TRUE analogue directional control, you chose where the ball goes, in pro evo, i've noticed so many times that although you might press UP to direct it into the corner it ends up going close to the keeper and he saves it

online - this is a joke. fifa wins hands down i dont even need to go on.

graphics - fifa obviously wins

licenses - " " "

Stamina, i think fifa have got it spot on. A short term fitness bar with a long term bar too. so over the period of a game, you can see the benefit of walking/not running everywhere

the only thing that could do with tweaking is the difference in Pace between players....
for example. Lennon doesnt feel faster than any left back i've played against, but in real life, he flys past them. even with Henry/saha/martins etc. you'd expect to be able to beat a few defenders easilly for pace. but it still seems a bit sluggish

wheres the swerve gone? back in the old days of kick off/sensible soccer/ISS/iss deluxe and even ISS on xbox, you could curl/swerve the ball. considering that pro evo and fifa are trying to be a simulation rather than arcade, why the hell isnt it possible to manually curl the ball on a cross or shot???????

essentially though. im wondering how you guys can think that the gameplay is better on pro evo 6

just to add, i have been a ISS fan since the good old days on the snes, i've played every incarnation of ISS/PES/WE:FE/LE i even played football kingdom which i thought had some fantastic game enhancements...
 
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Re penalties woz, you can use the lob button to do a panenca (whatever its called) and chip the goalie di canio / zidane style , you can use the finesse to place it in the corners and the normal shooting to power it in. Great system imo.
 
great post wozbacca. i agree with everything apart from the pace of players. Henry is shokckingly fast. :o he beats players with ease and you need to double up on him at all times!
 
@ gameklip, isnt that like real life aswell though? Remember him tearing the liverpool defense apart going past 2 defenders in one move at anfield a couple of years ago. Totally showed how slow the liverpool defense was then, they are even slower now :( He usually needs two defenders on him in real life just to back each other up.
 
In a really small nutshell, PES6(360) imo is nothing but konami trying to cash in on the oportunity to do close to nothing for as much as they can get. simple as, its a obvious as anything can be. Dont be fooled for one second by seabass's statement that "PES6(360) has been in development for 1 yr" or something like that, personally i think thats just bullshit talk to justify the individuals purchase of the product with relativity to work thats been put in, obviously its not a straight port from the ps2 version straight to the shelves, but saying that its not far from it either, i definately agree with what tiktiktiktiktiktikt(owch my fingers :mrgreen: ) is trying to put across,
tiktiktiktik said:
FIFA07 shows this very clearly imo, they have invested a lot for the nextgen, after gradually losing marketshare to nokami in the currentgen and next year will probably be the same. Nokami will make a new game which will form the base, as fifa07 will aswell and then they will continue in the same vain with incremental upgrades.
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next year we'll all be wowed by konami and the year after that?, it'll be the journey from PES2-PES5 all over again, saying that i dont expent too much from EA next year either, they'v finally got the formula, why risk tweaking it to destruction, "prolly just leave that in place and add some more teams/features into the game.... why the look?, its FIFA buddy, people'l still buy it" :roll:
 
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Yeah fifa has said as much, they will bring the data part up to scratch (teams/leagues/stadiums) and probably tweak the gameplay AI. Which in itself makes me look forward to it tbh, im really enjoying it, and if they can sort out some of the niggles (goalies, the player collision, etc) it will be a very good game. Its really up to nokami now to bring something decent to the table/console(s) to keep the balance even. As atm, with future potential in mind, fifa has the upperhand imo. Next year could be a great year for footie games, as this year has been, well.....pisspoor really from an overal perspective.
 
True. As much as I'm loving FIFA online, it is staggering that so much is missing from both games. I know programming is hard work but surely an extra month (or even three months) could have added e.g. an edit mode to PES6 and a World Cup to FIFA 07, which would have added a lot to the lifespan and the sellability (I'm tired, I forget the actual word for sellability). Anyone who will only play PES if they can add all the team names and sponsors, for example, will be considering a refund, and anyone who's bought FIFA 07 to play with their real-life mates will be considering the same (I was seriously looking forward to playing the game with my nephew, who loves it almost as much as I do, only to have to say to him "well, if we get a pen and paper, we can do a little league ourselves" - it's been said a fair few times but come on, SWOS is ten years old now and you didn't have to resort to a pen and paper back then, "next-gen" my arse).

To me, PES6 is a very minor step forward in gameplay (although saying that I can't play it, there's something that makes it unplayable - but the mass opinion is that it's been tweaked), FIFA 07 is a huge step forward in gameplay, but then both games limit what you can do with it (I have an open NAT, I have a brother-in-law who is a network engineer, and even he can't get PES6 working online - and as I've mentioned, in FIFA, offline-multiplayer-wise, you're limited to friendlies), which is ten steps back.

I don't get why people rave about the gameplay in PES and say it doesn't matter about the limited game modes (or no extra teams every year). To me, this (and the above shortcomings) is like having a Ferrari limited to 30mph. It's great but why don't you want more out of it, when it would only take the removal of the limiter - Konami spending a few extra grand and no extra development time to employ a few extra researchers and data inputters (PES6 is the top-selling XBOX 360 game already so it's not like it's going to kill them)?
 
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Guys, listen to Jack he speaks sense. I bought PES6 3 days early for the 360 and loved it at first. Then by the weekend I was bored senseless with it. Swapped it for FIFA07 today and I have to say that it's a FANTASTIC game. It is not limited like PES6.
 
*Falls over backwards*

That's one won over, 1,623,678 to go...

Although, with PES6 being the most successful 360 game to date, I doubt the number of converts will reach double-figures. :(
 
Nick Cave said:
Kgulls I have no problem with shots going over the bar or dodgy passes and crap runs, I would just like it to happen when I ask, I love the fact that FIFA, at least on the PS2 and Xbox gave us the chance to play with the lower league teams and have some good old scraps, I prefer this to playing with the all stars. I love having to grind out results and actually have to change tactics to suit the teams you play etc.

I've been saying the things about the choking effect Konami and EA are having on the football game scene for a long time, and your post is far more truth than cynical unfortunately.

Nobody wants to bring out a product with any kind of longevity anymore, certainly not Konami or EA and until someone new brings out a football game that surpasses both, nothing will change ...
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I long for the return of the days when the market had several footy options - sure some were god awful, but some (whilst not as "accurate" as PES or "pretty" as FIFA) offered something in terms of FUN!

I loved playing my mates on psone at Actual Soccer and UEFA challenge as they gave a fast and actioned packed (if far fetched) experience. Thought they sucked as single players. Back in the PSone days it was just great having a game for the mood you were in - "party" games for multi player, games like ISS for realism and FIFA for tactical etc...

It sucks the state were in whereby there are only two football options on the main consoles and it just highlights how much delevopers are now priced out of the market - only six years ago there were at least six different options of footy game(and thats excluding EAs options - FIFA, Prem Allstars, Champions league, EURO 2000 etc) on the PSone

Maybe the new XNA Studio development tool (and microsofts pledge to publish games on xbox live) will rectify this?????

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/4789809.stm

If not, all hope will be on Sensible World Of Soccer will be on Arcade in Jan!!
 
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