Romagnoli's PES 2012 Playtest Impressions

Thx for responding Rom,

Yeah i don't have problem too when executing lobbed through ball from behind an attacker, it is just somewhere near outside opponent'a box when my winger (on the ball) is almost in the same line with my attacker, chipping a lob ball using through ball button is quite a pain in the arse to determine how far/close i want to put it. But may be i just have to train using manual modifier + circle button added with PES 2012's more responsiveness and fluidity will help this playing style.

Anyway, for second part, as you mention
...balance between defender and attacker is much more even now..
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is reassuring then :))
 
Great stuff Rom. Did you play any 2v2 or 2vcpu games? Just wondering how the co-op cursor switching was?
 
Ivarov said:
Great stuff Rom. Did you play any 2v2 or 2vcpu games? Just wondering how the co-op cursor switching was?
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Better but still not great. It wouldn't switch control of the guy on the ball, but the right stick switching really didn't work as well as single player.
 
Finally 'made' the time to read the rest of this fantastic preview. Hat's off Rom, truly exceptional. Really appreciate the time and effort from your goodself and Rod, those were flawless by the way. ;)

Edit- Also, I know he may not be everybodies cup of tea, but we have to thank Adam for giving our lads the opportunity to test the game and report back to us in such stunning fashion. Credit where credits due. :)
 
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Rom, was the weather any different from PES11? Did it make the ball move as you see in real life?:))Oh and thanks for a great review.
 
First I didn't want to read that loooong preview but Jack scared me so much...:TUMBLE:

Great write-up, nicely detailed and without ignoring the negatves, only one important aspect seems to be completely missing: There is no word about the fatigue/stamina-system.

We all know it's broken and irrelevant in PES 2011, so I had hoped that in PES 2012 it might be fixed with a realistic fatigue/stamina-system, ie. a two-tiered system, one part dealing with the shortterm breath and the other with the mid- and longterm tiredness, a system that would measure the action on the pitch for every player individually and apply it realistically with stats in mind... both parts influencing each other.

But not one preview wants to talk about that important aspect leading me to the unnerving assumption that it hasn't been worked on since PES 2011. I hope I'm wrong.
 
henrys hand said:
First I didn't want to read that loooong preview but Jack scared me so much...:TUMBLE:

Great write-up, nicely detailed and without ignoring the negatves, only one important aspect seems to be completely missing: There is no word about the fatigue/stamina-system.

We all know it's broken and irrelevant in PES 2011, so I had hoped that in PES 2012 it might be fixed with a realistic fatigue/stamina-system, ie. a two-tiered system, one part dealing with the shortterm breath and the other with the mid- and longterm tiredness, a system that would measure the action on the pitch for every player individually and apply it realistically with stats in mind... both parts influencing each other.

But not one preview wants to talk about that important aspect leading me to the unnerving assumption that it hasn't been worked on since PES 2011. I hope I'm wrong.
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Murphy said
http://twitter.com/#!/JonMurphy_PES/status/99171278052790272

it's too little, i think nothing important will be done about that
 
I didn't even touch the edit mode or look at the full list of stadiums, as they aren't really my MO. I don't think we did try different weather settings as it goes - I think we just left things at Fine, with the time of day changing. Might be worth asking Adam about that via twitter or WENB, I know quite a few people are lined up to play this weekend.


I think I mentioned elsewhere that stamina wasn't really changed as far as we could see. But I don't think it needs to be as complicated as two-tier systems anyway - it's not about tech but implementation. The only important thing is for stamina to be related to effort spent in the game, and for it to have consequences for people who run around all game non-stop. Anything more than that is overengineering.
 
Just a reminder for you Rom regarding the question I asked you, with the youtube clip you couldn't watch on your phone.
 
Good stuff!

One question, not sure if anyone else cares about this but have the replay times been extended? The only bad side about scoring after after a long period of possession and neat passing is not being able to watch it all after! Especially when the build up contained an awesome pass or two, great dribble or other bit of skill.

I know Satnik shares my pain :D.
 
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kouroux said:
Just a reminder for you Rom regarding the question I asked you, with the youtube clip you couldn't watch on your phone.
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I couldn't say really. I hope so, but we didn't try it as far as I remember.

Ern Dog said:
Good stuff!

One question, not sure if anyone else cares about this but have the replay times been extended? The only bad side about scoring after after a long period of possession and neat passing is not being able to watch it all after! Especially when the build up contained an awesome pass or two, great dribble or other bit of skill.

I know Satnik shares my pain :D.
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I think they're much the same. I do like in FIFA how, on the PS3 at least, the replay can rewind right to kickoff. It's worth mentioning to Konami but no joy this year.




There was a question about supporting midfield movement for passes back - I didn't notice specific movements like this but that doesn't mean they weren't there. I don't remember ever struggling to find a safe option, not once.
 
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Thanks for the reply Rom, I really like that about FIFA also. I think they introduced that full length replay it in 09? Seabass really should of taken note by now and gave us a bit more time, by the sounds of things it would of been even more useful this year aswel. Maybe next year :PRAY:
 
As for less attack-minded full-backs, I remember thinking that Wolves in particular seemed very shy of supporting movement. I didn't specifically try and test it by changing players based on attack/defence work rates, but I did keep an eye out for what fullbacks were doing and how the defence reacted as the opposition countered.

If your fullbacks are caught high up the pitch, the ability of defensive midfielders and centre backs to cover and spread to mark threats was a lot more conducive to how sides with attacking fullbacks deal with being caught on the break, actually flattening and spreading wide as more of a back three. The reduced pace of the ball also contributes by stopping counters and long passes upfield from being quite so impervious to interception or repositioning.

It's worth mentioning that in a couple of games I boosted the position switching a bit and pushed the full-backs up to encourage more aggressive runs. Tiote seemed to stay very deep for Newcastle too, which was a nice change from my current MLO where Toulalan seems desperate to score at times (though Zambrotta and De Jong seem quite sensible about how far up they push as it goes).

So I do think that there has been a subtle shift in the conditions you need for fullbacks to overlap and for DMs to push up (in fact I think one of the PES vids points out the midfield changes). But it's the sort of thing where you need to concertedly test it - both as the team with the overlappers, and as a team with 3 forwards trying to exploit it.

The best I can say right now is that I didn't really feel like I had to change anything to tell fullbacks to be more defensive, and I did once successfully tweak to get them more involved in the attack. For more, I'd ask Lami to try using Barcelona or Brazil and trying to tell the fullbacks to stay well back.
 
Thanks for the detailed preview.
question:
In real football the way players act and react is different inside and outside the box. you lose the calmness, everything becomes quicker, reactions are faster and defenders are panicking most of the time. can we sense this feeling in this year's build? this is something that has been missing in the series, not to say that it's completely off but it doesn't match the real deal.
thanks in advance for the answer!
 
Awesome preview Romagnoli. Great work. You can trust the lads at Evo web to cover every base.

BTW do you play 11 on console or PC? I am just wondering if your impressions of responsiveness and AI in PES2012 were compared to vanilla PES2011 or with Yair's/Jenkey's animation & AI boosts.
 
Bendit said:
Awesome preview Romagnoli. Great work. You can trust the lads at Evo web to cover every base.

BTW do you play 11 on console or PC? I am just wondering if your impressions of responsiveness and AI in PES2012 were compared to vanilla PES2011 or with Yair's/Jenkey's animation & AI boosts.
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Vanilla console.

MJ_Mohsen - to me that's the sort of thing that should be a side effect of the way the rest of the game plays, rather than clear stat boosts or animation changes. You should be more hectic and panicky/urgent in the box because being in the box gives you that adrenalin rush; more compact defences and players trying to get in the way of shots should have this effect rather than reaction time changes or the like. I feel 2012 does this well enough for me but I don't know if that's what you're after.
 
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romagnoli said:
Vanilla console.

MJ_Mohsen - to me that's the sort of thing that should be a side effect of the way the rest of the game plays, rather than clear stat boosts or animation changes. You should be more hectic and panicky/urgent in the box because being in the box gives you that adrenalin rush; more compact defences and players trying to get in the way of shots should have this effect rather than reaction time changes or the like. I feel 2012 does this well enough for me but I don't know if that's what you're after.
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thanks for the quick reply. yes, that's what I'm after. I don't encourage stat boosts or special animation, I'm looking for more activity and awareness. I want to feel and see that players are aware of conceding goals, I wanna see that they know this is a matter of life or death and I think this can be achieved with a more active behavior overall. I trust you enough to be sure that this is accomplished anyway! :COOL:
 
It's subjective really. I guess the main thing is that I felt it was a matter of life and death! Not sure what my players thought. I'd recommend going to Lami about this, he's still got his playtest coming.
 
Rom, what could you see of continous play in the preview-code? Is that feature still there? Can one do quick throwins, free kicks... without the magic resetting of players on the pitch?

Would be great since it is used in real life football to keep up the speed of a build-up-play...

Speaking of speed, how did you perceive gamespeed and gamepace as well as the ebb and flow to be? Did you find it to be like in real life football? And what speed-setting did you think best reflected reallife football?

By the way you indeed mentioned the missing changes to the stamina/fatigue-model as a worry, must have overlooked it in my first reading, I apologise for suggesting otherwise.
 
You have both, but the quick throw-ins are a bit dubious. I don't know if they reset but it shows a cutscene of a player on the pitch first, and then a guy runs to the touchline to take the throw. So it takes a fair while at the mo.

When you switch players for FKs or add/remove players from your wall, they don't magically appear/vanish, and the game doesn't go black and return with the right kick taker. Defenders run to the wall and take position, or swap takers as you would in real life. No more using FK switch to remove defenders from the line. Sounds bad, but you've got the off the ball stuff to exploit the space if a defender drops way back. Also, keepers are better at saving 20yd free kicks that go over the wall.

So Konami have pretty much covered every angle as far as short FKs are concerned.
 
For gamespeed. I'm happy with 0 myself. We didn't try any other speeds either - I did suggest trying -1 as I reckon people here will want one or the other.

I've been playing 2011 now and I'm sure it's slightly faster, though that is chiefly down to the ball speed when passing and the slightly more zoomed in camera. I can't really make a call about which gamespeed is 'best' or most realistic because a few people here think -2 is most realistic in 2011 and I most certainly don't.

I cheated with the stamina btw - check the edit time! ;)
 
romagnoli said:
You have both, but the quick throw-ins are a bit dubious. I don't know if they reset but it shows a cutscene of a player on the pitch first, and then a guy runs to the touchline to take the throw. So it takes a fair while at the mo.

When you switch players for FKs or add/remove players from your wall, they don't magically appear/vanish, and the game doesn't go black and return with the right kick taker. Defenders run to the wall and take position, or swap takers as you would in real life. No more using FK switch to remove defenders from the line. Sounds bad, but you've got the off the ball stuff to exploit the space if a defender drops way back. Also, keepers are better at saving 20yd free kicks that go over the wall.

So Konami have pretty much covered every angle as far as short FKs are concerned.
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So its back! and they have improved it :WORSHIP:
 
romagnoli said:
For gamespeed. I'm happy with 0 myself. We didn't try any other speeds either - I did suggest trying -1 as I reckon people here will want one or the other.

I've been playing 2011 now and I'm sure it's slightly faster, though that is chiefly down to the ball speed when passing and the slightly more zoomed in camera. I can't really make a call about which gamespeed is 'best' or most realistic because a few people here think -2 is most realistic in 2011 and I most certainly don't.
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I for one prefer speed -1, sometimes even -2, but then the players are too heavy in turning, that's why I go back to -1 or even 0. If PES 2012 is like that or a bit slower it would be alright.

romagnoli said:
I cheated with the stamina btw - check the edit time! ;)
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And I thought I was getting old... sleek move.:LOL:
 
romagnoli said:
You have both, but the quick throw-ins are a bit dubious. I don't know if they reset but it shows a cutscene of a player on the pitch first, and then a guy runs to the touchline to take the throw. So it takes a fair while at the mo.

When you switch players for FKs or add/remove players from your wall, they don't magically appear/vanish, and the game doesn't go black and return with the right kick taker. Defenders run to the wall and take position, or swap takers as you would in real life. No more using FK switch to remove defenders from the line. Sounds bad, but you've got the off the ball stuff to exploit the space if a defender drops way back. Also, keepers are better at saving 20yd free kicks that go over the wall.

So Konami have pretty much covered every angle as far as short FKs are concerned.
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So continous play isn't really in so that you can use it to keep a dynamic play in movement.

Another small thing that disturbs me in PES 2011 is that when the ball gets into side- or corner-out and one of my players tries to keep the ball in play and runs to it and gets to the ball and wants to pass it or shoot but in the milli-second the ball gets into the out he stops his pass/shoot-animation... like a robot. It feels so unnatural as in reality players try to shoot and pass the ball eventhough they might be over the line cause they don't have lasereyes and do what they do until a referree tells them otherwise...

The same applies to offside-calls, the players stop immediately their animation..

How is it in PES 2012?
 
I have a question, and forgive me if it's already been asked.

Is there more realistic ball movement this year? I mean when shooting really, I know Konami have always gone for subtlety with regards to curl, dip, and hook shots. I guess I just wish they were a little more noticable and varied, considering the ball does move about a lot in the air these days. (Or so the goalkeepers keep saying) :)
 
I think you touched upon it a bit, but how was the sense of momentum/inertia and acceleration, was it satisfactory? From the new short videos with the indian guy it looks really good when the ball carrier makes a sharp turn and the defender gets wrong footed. However in the early leaked videos there wasn't, to me, much sense of acceleration. It seemed like player went too fast to top speed. Any further comments on this? Thanks.
 
Rob said:
I have a question, and forgive me if it's already been asked.

Is there more realistic ball movement this year? I mean when shooting really, I know Konami have always gone for subtlety with regards to curl, dip, and hook shots. I guess I just wish they were a little more noticable and varied, considering the ball does move about a lot in the air these days. (Or so the goalkeepers keep saying) :)
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I think there's meant to be from what I've read but I'm hoping it's noticeable. I mean FIFA's ball movement on shooting looks a lot better even though hitting a cracking shot on PES FEELS better ;)
 
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