Pere Ubu
Championship
- 29 October 2002
Everyone in this thread has a point. WE9 IS the most realistic in terms of overall AI, and it's true what the technical people here are saying, the current AI pushes the PS2 to the max.
Benn is right though, there are a lot of weak points in the AI and some of them are new in this version. But first of all, there are more GOOD new AI tweaks than bad, when you weigh them up - because the PS2 processor is already working flat out for WE games, they can't just keep improving by ADDING things, they have to reshuffle what's there just to fit it in. So to make the overall covering play of computer-controlled defenders better, we lose a small amount of the fluidity of dribbling that was in WE8LE. It's a balance, and when you think of how wrong it could have gone, I'd say the balance is ok.
Secondly, there are always niggling problems in the first release of any WE game, which get sorted either by PES or FE/LE. So the final release of any version in the series is always more popular with some people than the first release of the newer one. I've seen this happen every time, WE6FE was God to some people round here who thought WE7 was just the end of the line, lol, but NO ONE preferred it to WE7I. And then a lot of people thought WE8 was sticky and lumpy compared to WE7I, but how many prefer WE8 to WE8LE?
The point is that maybe we should think of the final Jap Spring release as the "real" version of each game, and the new version in the summer as a beta. That shows up Konami's greed (if they were a club, they'd change their home and away strip every single season), but it makes more sense.
Zyg is also very right. The problem isn't with the actual game code, anyway. Konami have always been the same - they shoot themselves in the foot, making a fantastic game and then letting dumb obvious mistakes creep in in the most stupid ways. Having worked in various industries which are similar to computer games in many ways, I can make an educated guess at why: the creative guys like Seabass will be underpaid, dedicated geniuses doing everything to make the greatest game ever, then they'll be let down by the other two sides. The pen-pushers and careerists who get jobs like database research and writing the algorithms for Master League etc, will do a shoddy job and hand in bad stats (half of them probably don't even know football) and then the management will just be trying to save money and undermining everything with not enough development money, refusal to get licenses etc. In other words, they have these amazing guys working magic, but then they can't get the EASY stuff right.
So...... yeah, as far as gameplay goes, sooner or later there will be a patch / option file like PLF's data for WE8LE, which I only got to play for a month or something before WE9, but which completely transformed the gameplay for me and a lot of other people. It really brought out the best in the game, which was smothered by a crappy database, just as the cups and leagues are smothered by a crappy structure and lack of options.
Benn is right though, there are a lot of weak points in the AI and some of them are new in this version. But first of all, there are more GOOD new AI tweaks than bad, when you weigh them up - because the PS2 processor is already working flat out for WE games, they can't just keep improving by ADDING things, they have to reshuffle what's there just to fit it in. So to make the overall covering play of computer-controlled defenders better, we lose a small amount of the fluidity of dribbling that was in WE8LE. It's a balance, and when you think of how wrong it could have gone, I'd say the balance is ok.
Secondly, there are always niggling problems in the first release of any WE game, which get sorted either by PES or FE/LE. So the final release of any version in the series is always more popular with some people than the first release of the newer one. I've seen this happen every time, WE6FE was God to some people round here who thought WE7 was just the end of the line, lol, but NO ONE preferred it to WE7I. And then a lot of people thought WE8 was sticky and lumpy compared to WE7I, but how many prefer WE8 to WE8LE?
The point is that maybe we should think of the final Jap Spring release as the "real" version of each game, and the new version in the summer as a beta. That shows up Konami's greed (if they were a club, they'd change their home and away strip every single season), but it makes more sense.
Zyg is also very right. The problem isn't with the actual game code, anyway. Konami have always been the same - they shoot themselves in the foot, making a fantastic game and then letting dumb obvious mistakes creep in in the most stupid ways. Having worked in various industries which are similar to computer games in many ways, I can make an educated guess at why: the creative guys like Seabass will be underpaid, dedicated geniuses doing everything to make the greatest game ever, then they'll be let down by the other two sides. The pen-pushers and careerists who get jobs like database research and writing the algorithms for Master League etc, will do a shoddy job and hand in bad stats (half of them probably don't even know football) and then the management will just be trying to save money and undermining everything with not enough development money, refusal to get licenses etc. In other words, they have these amazing guys working magic, but then they can't get the EASY stuff right.
So...... yeah, as far as gameplay goes, sooner or later there will be a patch / option file like PLF's data for WE8LE, which I only got to play for a month or something before WE9, but which completely transformed the gameplay for me and a lot of other people. It really brought out the best in the game, which was smothered by a crappy database, just as the cups and leagues are smothered by a crappy structure and lack of options.
