World Cup 2010 - The Argentina Thread - Una pasion unica

ALBICELESTE2010

ALBICELESTE2010

Champions League
13 July 2006
Watford
Argentina & Watford
Argentine_Football_Association_logo.png

Entrenador: Diego Maradona

Arqueros: Sergio Romero (AZ Alkmaar), Mariano Andujar (Catania), Diego Pozo (Colon);

Defensores: Nicolas Burdisso (Inter Milan), Martin Demichelis (Bayern Munich), Walter Samuel (Inter Milan), Gabriel Heinze (Olympique Marseille), Nicolas Otamendi (Velez Sarsfield), Fabricio Coloccini (Newcastle), Juan Manuel Insaurralde (Newell’s Old Boys), Clemente Rodriguez (Estudiantes), Ariel Garce (Colon);

Mediocampistas: Javier Mascherano (Liverpool), Sebastian Blanco (Lanus), Juan Sebastian Veron (Estudiantes), Jesus Datolo (Olympiacos), Jose Sosa (Estudiantes), Maximiliano Rodriguez (Liverpool), Mario Bolatti (Fiorentina), Juan Mercier (Argentinos Juniors), Angel Di María (Benfica), Jonas Gutiérrez (Newcastle), Javier Pastore (Palermo);

Delanteros: Sergio Agüero (Atletico Madrid), Diego Milito (Inter Milan), Martin Palermo (Boca Juniors), Carlos Tevez (Manchester City), Gonzalo Higuain (Real Madrid), Lionel Messi (Barcelona), Ezequiel Lavezzi (Napoli).

So the dreaded thirty has been announced. Half of those chosen should not even be in South Africa but we should have expected it having a 'coach' like Maradona in charge.Who should be cut ?

How far can we go this time ? Will it be the heartache of 2002 and watching while Bielsa takes Chile further than us ?

We've had far more talented squads than this and fallen on our faces. The 1978 and 1986 squads were not a collection of stars but a team of hard workers with a scattering of star's and in 1986 one in particular.

Does this new counter attacking system suit our style of traditional posession, pass and move ?

I personally am angered by the omissions of Zanetti, Cambiasso , Banega , Lisandro , Lucho , Garay , Ansaldi.

Cambiasso when played in his correct position by a proper coach unlike Basile fielding him out on the left of midfield is a proper replacement for Mascherano who thanks to his tireless work rate is bound to pick up cards.

Banega should have been in as the link player in midfield and Garay can play right back as at the Olympics ahead of Otamendi while Ansaldi is a natural left back.

Clemente is too peripheral and poor defensively.

But we shall support our boys to the last:
YouTube - vamos vamos argentina
YouTube - La Hinchada Argentina (Lo Mejor por lejos)YouTube - Argentina Anthem - Beijing 2008 Football Semi-Final

:APPLAUD::APPLAUD::APPLAUD:
 
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with all due respect, I think the competition was too big for lisandro. he could have been chosen for lavezzi but I think lavezzi will be cut later (at least I hope that maradona wont make a mistake and cut milito). I am also sad about cambiasso and lucho a bit but the rest seems fine for me. garay hasnt been impressive for real madrid, neither has banega in my opinion. so, lets support the albiceleste. :D vamos argentina!
 
For me Lisandro are much better than Lavezzi, all French love him (in only few months), because of grinta, this guy give all in a football game.
 
ThomasGOAL said:
For me Lisandro are much better than Lavezzi, all French love him (in only few months), because of grinta, this guy give all in a football game.
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I agree with you on this Thomas. He gives it his all.

The reason he has been out of favour it is supposed , is because he and several other players dared to question Diego on his tactics and preperation for the Bolivia game.

So long as he remains coach no Lisandro.

Milanists I'd keep Lavezzi if only to give depth on the flanks where we just have di Maria and Maxi.

I agree to a certain extent on this Napoli connection .It's the only one I can think of why Datolo who was offloaded by Napoli is in somehow .Either that or because he toes the line with Diego.

Great goal against Brazil and nice finish against Russia but for his club Olympiakos nothing.

Ernestito Banega has been in great form. I rated him at the 2007 u20 WC among the three best Argentine players the others being Aguero and di Maria.

He has one of the best passing sucess in La Liga and near the top of assists table in La Liga and when he has been absent from Valencia they have suffered in midfield.

He would be ideal for me and a key component of the Argentina midfield post 2010 ahead of Gago in tandem with Pastore.

My selection would have been:
GK Romero, Andujar, Speroni
DF Zanetti,Samuel,Dimichelis,Garay,Burdisso,Ansaldi,Monzon
MF Maxi, Messi, di Maria, Mascherano, Cambiasso, Banega, Pastore
Sosa
FW Higuain, D.Milito, Lisandro, Tevez, Aguero


-------------------------Romero------------------------------
Zanetti--------Burdisso-------Samuel-------------Ansaldi-----
-----------------Mascherano----------------------------------
------------------------------Banega-------------------------
--------------------------Pastore----------------------------
-----Messi---------------------------------------di Maria----
-------------------------Higuain-----------------------------

Experienced at the back and plenty of movement and flair upfront and no shortage of skill to unlock defences.
 
to be fair, i don't think lisandro and lavezzi are in competition. they're different players who play in a different role. lisandro's competitors are higuain and milito... and, as much as i like lisandro (and i really do!), those 2 monsters are just better than him. i'd say lavezzi's competitors are di maria and tevez.

the cambiasso situation is the most ridiculous anyway. i mean i could understand maradona for dropping lisandro (since he already has 2 world class cf in the team), but dropping one of the best metodistas in the world and calling up bolatti (who is nothing but a promising youngster) is just INSANE. :SHOCK:
 
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lo zio said:
to be fair, i don't think lisandro and lavezzi are in competition. they're different players who play in a different role. lisandro's competitors are higuain and milito... and, as much as i like lisandro (and i really do!), those 2 monsters are just better than him. i'd say lavezzi's competitors are di maria and tevez.

the cambiasso situation is the most ridiculous anyway. i mean i could understand maradona for dropping lisandro (since he already has 2 world class cf in the team), but dropping one of the best metodistas in the world and calling up bolatti (who is nothing but a promising youngster) is just INSANE. :SHOCK:
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You've seen Pastore at Palermo lo zio . I hope he get's the role of directing the midfield over Veron should we progress.

I cannot see Veron lasting the pace. He has stuggled in other games.

As for Bolatti he was decent under Cappa at Huracan but at the Viola he has done nothing has had limited playing time and seems to be rewarded for five minutes against Uruguay and scoring a goal (granted it was impressive after not winning in Montevideo for thirty years).

And at 25 he is not even a kid. Franco Zuculini is a kid. ;)
 
I don't know where to begin with Maradonna... I hope the best for Argentina but with him in charge, they'll probably under-achieve and if not it'll be down to pure individual magic from someone like Messi to save his ass!
 
albiceleste said:
And at 25 he is not even a kid. Franco Zuculini is a kid.
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25!? i thought he was younger than that! yeah he didn't get much playtime this season in firenze, but prandelli has progressively given him more minutes all along the season. and i also have to say he's done pretty well. but anyway, i'd never pick a 25 years old player who "has done pretty well" ahead of a world class legend like el cuchu :))

as for pastore, he seems to be a legend in the making. when he first came in palermo, i was quite skeptical about him. i usually don't trust in the hype that surrounds talented youngsters and i also thought that, being so young, he would have needed at least a season to settle in italy (although from argentina to sicily there isn't really a dramatical change).
man he did prove me wrong! he had an instant impact on the team and has been tearing apart some very challenging defensive lines this season.
however, being argentina's trequartista is a huge responsability and i'm not sure the kid is ready to handle such pressure yet..... but then again, javier already proved me wrong once, so he might well do it again. :))
PLF said:
I don't know where to begin with Maradonna... I hope the best for Argentina but with him in charge, they'll probably under-achieve
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yeah, it's a shame to hand so much quality to a clueless coach like diego.
 
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PLF said:
I don't know where to begin with Maradonna... I hope the best for Argentina but with him in charge, they'll probably under-achieve and if not it'll be down to pure individual magic from someone like Messi to save his ass!
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While Messi does not need a push pull payer like Xavi all the time as shown by his stint when Xavi was injured for Barca he rarely gets the ball in dangerous positions.

Too often he is coming deep. Why ? Veron cannot burst past opponents and commit them say like a Banega or Aimar.

His passes are too easily cut out forcing Messi to drop deep. Furthermore it allows the opposition DMs to sit on Messi because they know Veron cannot commit a player.

The lack of movement is shocking as well which is and has been a trademark of all Argentina sides, receive pass and move.

It leaves Leo with precious little space. Every game I've seen he does take n 4-5 players and almost beats them but is held up at the last.

Sadly all it has done is given ammunition to certain detractors that he is becoming the new pecho frio of the seleccion, that he does not replicate his club form at the national level.

Given the absence of tactics, he right personell around him it's no surprise.

It is harder than ever for an individual to shine on the world stage as football becomes more than ever a collective team game.

At the very least with players like Aguero and Tevez in reserve at least in the last thirty minutes opposition defences will or should be in a tizz.

Pity the CL final is at such a ridiculously late date in view of the fact it is a WC year. No doubt UEFA and FIFA haggling again.
 
lo zio said:
25!? i thought he was younger than that! yeah he didn't get much playtime this season in firenze, but prandelli has progressively given him more minutes all along the season. and i also have to say he's done pretty well. but anyway, i'd never pick a 25 years old player who "has done pretty well" ahead of a world class legend like el cuchu :))

as for pastore, he seems to be a legend in the making. when he first came in palermo, i was quite skeptical about him. i usually don't trust in the hype that surrounds talented youngsters and i also thought that, being so young, he would have needed at least a season to settle in italy (although from argentina to sicily there isn't really a dramatical change).
man he did prove me wrong! he had an instant impact on the team and has been tearing apart some very challenging defensive lines this season.
however, being argentina's trequartista is a huge responsability and i'm not sure the kid is ready to handle such pressure yet..... but then again, javier already proved me wrong once, so he might well do it again. :))

yeah, it's a shame to hand so much quality to a clueless coach like diego.
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Like Banega Pastore favoured basketball over football lo zio. I am actually surprised (knowing how Diego does not tolerate what he sees as disobedience) that he was included though I have seen several of his games and automatically selected him for my XI.

This was because he refused a call up to the u20 that failed to qualify for the 2009 u20 WC though it was more down to Huracan not letting him go.

As a character he is pretty cool and level headed unlike Banega and I am sure he can take the pressure. ;)

It would be nice to see him play CL football with Palermo if results go right your way this weekend and of course I hope Javier does not pick up an injury.
 
I remember seeing the local channel when they presented the WC squad for 2006. At the stadium full capacity at night w/ light and fire works .Was amazing how they presented the team. I can`t wait to see this year.
 
beboq said:
I remember seeing the local channel when they presented the WC squad for 2006. At the stadium full capacity at night w/ light and fire works .Was amazing how they presented the team. I can`t wait to see this year.
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Argentina will play Canada on May 24th in El Monumental as part of the nations 200th anniversary celebrations so that alone should be spetacular and I assume the 30 selected will pop up as well and be presented to the fans.
 
I Still think that Diego milito could be used in a 433.

Milito - Higuain/Tevez - Messi

I often see him hughing the line and cutting to the center, just like Pep used Titi last season. Higuain and Tevez are the usual beasts and messi could be used in the same way that Guardiola used him last season (not like this season, i hate to see him in a free roled playmaker).
Lucho behind him with some1 like Aimar and Masch/Cambiasso a bit behind destroying game. You would have a sweet attacking team.
Too bad Maradona and his idealisms are in charge.
 
Wow, Cambiasso and Zanetti will miss the cup? Maradona is a fool. Argentina has the best attack in the world, but is lacking a lot of quality and balance in the midfield and a lot of experience in the back. Unbalanced teams like that usually don't go far into big cups. But Messi is there, that guy is god and can truly make the difference.

I really hope the referees protect quality players during the tournament, as they usually do in world cups more than in the domestic leagues.
 
We know how the rest of the world feels about it but what's the reaction in Argentina, I'm curious as to the exclusion of the legendary Javier Zanetti and Inter's heart-beat and one of the world's truly best, Esteban Cambiasso?

Banega, Lucho Gonzalez and Lisandro Lopez are also unfortunate omissions as they're class AND had great seasons!

EDIT:
I'm guessing Maradonna doesn't like Lucho for some reason? while of course he LOVES Jonas Gutierrez! He said he'd get picked even if Newcastle were relegated to 3rd division earlier in season! :LOL:
 
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PLF said:
We know how the rest of the world feels about it but what's the reaction in Argentina, I'm curious as to the exclusion of the legendary Javier Zanetti and Inter's heart-beat and one of the world's truly best, Esteban Cambiasso?

Banega, Lucho Gonzalez and Lisandro Lopez are also unfortunate omissions as they're class AND had great seasons!

EDIT:
I'm guessing Maradonna doesn't like Lucho for some reason? while of course he LOVES Jonas Gutierrez! He said he'd get picked even if Newcastle were relegated to 3rd division earlier in season! :LOL:
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Apparently the biggest upset in Argentina is the exclusions of Zanetti and Cambiasso.

But most people are unsurprised at the selection knowing how Maradona behaves. Most people dislike the overall selection and the Argentine public love and know their football.

As for Lucho he was April player of the month in the Championat and delivering wonderful set pieces. He could tuck in easily alongside Masche.

I mean Banega then Lucho then Cuchu as choices. Banega brings the most dynamism. Gago no go this season.

Apparently after the Bolivia game certain players questioned the preperation.

After all it was only a 6-1 defeat one of the joint worst ever suffered and the biggest since Colombia in 1993. Most of the players could barely run in the second half.

Those that were questioning such as Lucho have been canned which illustrates Diego's petty childish nature. Others like di Maria who picked up a ridiculous red card in the game a minute after coming on I seem to remember have survived (though di Maria can become a stellar player so is well worth taking along).
 
Glavisted said:
It's a pity about Cambiasso and Zanetti, also about Braña, Ansaldi, Lisandro, Gabriel Milito and Banega.
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Agreed Glavisted. Ansaldi and Zanetti as fullbacks might be a critical weakness. Banega to provide the link between front and back.

Brana is injured and there are better ie Banega. G.Milito same as Burdisso has been excellent for Roma this season. Lisandro I would have chosen but what can you do.


Here is the final 23 announced:
Argentina final 23:

Goalkeepers: Sergio ROMERO, Mariano ANDUJAR, Diego POZO

Defenders: Nicolas BURDISSO, Clemente RODRIGUEZ, Martin DEMICHELIS, Ariel GARCE, Gabriel HEINZE, Nicolas OTAMENDI, Walter SAMUEL

Midfielders: Jonas GUTIERREZ, Javier MASCHERANO, Juan Sebastian VERON, Angel DI MARIA, Mario BOLATTI, Maxi RODRIGUEZ, Javier PASTORE

Forwards: Lionel MESSI, Gonzalo HIGUAIN, Carlos TEVEZ, Diego MILITO, Sergio AGUERO, Martin PALERMO

Ariel Garce has made it.

Weaknesses: Fullback positions. Clemente may not be tough enough to take out the opposition wide players while Otamendi or Burdisso if played there are too slow. Garce could come in as he has done solidly for Colon.

Bolatti as a replacement for Masche ???

Palermo a waste of a spot ? Rather have an extra midfielder or defender. Could be a plan Z when required ie lob the ball into the box.

Strengths. Top class keeper for once. Solid central defence if not the paciest. Top class DM in monster Masche. Pastore can bring what we need in the midfield.

Flanks trickery and pace with di Maria, Maxi and Messi. Upfront a deadly strike force ideal to bring on D.Milito and Aguero say with half an hour to go or drop Tevez into an AM role.
 
GK: Sergio ROMERO, Mariano ANDUJAR, Diego POZO
DF: Gabriel HEINZE, Martin DEMICHELIS, Walter SAMUEL, Javier ZANETTI, Cristian ANSALDI, Nicolas BURDISSO, Gabriel MILITO, Nicolas OTAMENDI
MF: Javier MASCHERANO, Esteban CAMBIASSO, Lucho GONZALEZ, Ever BANEGA, Javier PASTORE, Pablo AIMAR, Maxi RODRIGUEZ, Angel DI MARIA
FW: Lionel MESSI, Gonzalo HIGUAIN, Carlos TEVEZ, Diego MILITO, Lisandro LOPEZ

1st 11

------------------Romero-----------------
Zanetti - Demichelis - W. Samuel - Heinze
-----------------Cambiasso----------------
--------------Lucho-----------------------
----------------------Aimar---------------
Messi----------------------Di Maria/Milito
------------------Higuain-----------------

Bah...
 
I honestly dont trust romero but well, its maradonas choice. I would have chosen brooooooooooooooun :D (he is still injured though)

I agree that palermo is a wasted spot, you could have a fullback or a defensive midfielder instead. if the balance between midfield and defence is not given (and it really seems like that) then argentina will conced a lot of goals. I really really hope that the defence does a great job.
 
ah yes, pato. this guy will never stop playing I guess. :) legendary keeper and he would surely fit in here. I am still claiming that Argentina would have knocked out Germany in 2006 if he wasnt injured in that game and therefore could not participate in the penalty shootout (copa libertadores semi-final in 2004 boca-river with pato being the hero, then again copa sudamericana final 2005 against unam pumas etc.)
 
Okay let me answer these questions:
1.yes I feel five strikers is enough esp.when Messi can be played
as a shadow striker. Central midfield is a bit bare
2.Bolatti. Yes he has not yet adapted to serie A and barely
played but at Huracan in the same role he was excellent in
tandem with Pastore
3.Romero is a very very good keeper. Great shot stopper and comes
out to claim crosses. Good positional sense.

Andujar has performed reliably for Catania. Carizzo unfortunately has made two bad career moves to Lazio and then Zaragoza and barely had any game time this season. Ustari might have been a better bet than Pozo, as is Gabbarini who is developing nicely.

Assman might have been present had he also not made a poor career choice in joining Getafe a year ago.

Romero is attracting interest from many top European clubs so for once we have a decent keeper. ;) Might have some workto do this summer though. :P

There has to be optimism with that pace and trickery down the flanks, subtle skills of Pastore and lethal strike force, solid centrebacks and keeper.

It could have been a far better squad ie as Neoexodus's lineup shows but we have to go with what we have been given.
 
No I think Argentina would've had the strongest squad if it wasn't for Maradonna. But now I think Spain is better.

@Albi, good to see you have so much confidence in Romero. From what I've seen of him and Andujar and Carrizo and other Argentinian keepers these days, they're all good but not great. But I think you've seen him a lot more than I have so I'll take your word and confidence in him and hope he performs well in World cup. We'll find out soon if Sergio and Co. are up to the task or not, I guess.
 
PLF said:
No I think Argentina would've had the strongest squad if it wasn't for Maradonna. But now I think Spain is better.

@Albi, good to see you have so much confidence in Romero. From what I've seen of him and Andujar and Carrizo and other Argentinian keepers these days, they're all good but not great. But I think you've seen him a lot more than I have so I'll take your word and confidence in him and hope he performs well in World cup. We'll find out soon if Sergio and Co. are up to the task or not, I guess.
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Indeed PLF. ;) Gabe.Paul.Logan it could have been the strongest squad alongside Spain had the 'right' players been picked.

Now it's probably the best set of forwards and half decent midfield and defence.

I guess Bilardo is going on a few stars mixed with hard workers and no nonsense players.

I found this on YT the other day and really enjoyed it:
YouTube - VideoFan: Vamos Argentina! (Sudáfrica 2010) - Wavin' Flag (HD)
 
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