Let's FIFA 11/12/13: Making the perfect football game.

Likewise. I think they're doing the right thing to listen to fans, especially those like us who I like to think have a good idea of what we're on about, and it is quite impressive to see the lead designer actively seeking advice like this. The problem is the sheer amount of teenage bile and inane fluff you have to wade through to find a half decent thread on the official forums. I don't really see how you can get anything useful out of that place at all - it's like the toilets on the last day of Reading festival; there's a foul atmosphere, kids are trying to set fire to things and the place is overflowing with thousands of people's shite.
 
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I hope you brought up the player lock limit Jamezinho, that's the biggest problem to me.

I've mentioned it before but the feeling of the game being "scripted" has to go. I strongly believe the success of PES is because it had the feeling that anything could happen. Yes the keepers are not very good, but this is mostly because they are not doing completely scripted saves like in FIFA.

The ball felt completely loose in PES and in FIFA it still feels "scripted" in some situations. This, to me, is mainly because of the player lock limit (only one player from each team can attack the ball), but also because there ARE fully scripted events... when someone clears the ball for example. Everyone that has played FIFA 10 knows that when defenders are winning the header on a corner, the ball will go out to the same spot outside the box. We also know where the ball will end up depending on where the player that clears a ball are on the pitch.

PES felt chaotic, in a GOOD way, and that feeling is still not in FIFA even if FIFA 10 took a tiny step in the right direction. For example the keeper saves are less scripted than 09, and where the ball ends up after a standing tackle is now dynamic which it wasn't in 09.
 
Gab_ said:
I hope you brought up the player lock limit Jamezinho, that's the biggest problem to me.

I've mentioned it before but the feeling of the game being "scripted" has to go. I strongly believe the success of PES is because it had the feeling that anything could happen. Yes the keepers are not very good, but this is mostly because they are not doing completely scripted saves like in FIFA.

The ball felt completely loose in PES and in FIFA it still feels "scripted" in some situations. This, to me, is mainly because of the player lock limit (only one player from each team can attack the ball), but also because there ARE fully scripted events... when someone clears the ball for example. Everyone that has played FIFA 10 knows that when defenders are winning the header on a corner, the ball will go out to the same spot outside the box. We also know where the ball will end up depending on where the player that clears a ball are on the pitch.

PES felt chaotic, in a GOOD way, and that feeling is still not in FIFA even if FIFA 10 took a tiny step in the right direction. For example the keeper saves are less scripted than 09, and where the ball ends up after a standing tackle is now dynamic which it wasn't in 09.
Click to expand...

Sorry Gab, I forgot about this.:DOH:

Quite an important one as well.

Gary obviously keeps an eye on this forum so hopefully he has read your suggestions and taken them on board. He said that most of the things on my list were being worked on, which is encouraging. All the usual suspects like floaty ball physics, shooting, lack of player individuality, over physicality, over reliance on pressing to defend, etc etc....

Like romagnoli said, he can probably get sensible, measured feedback from a site like this rather than the drivelling kids/cretins (all with CR9 avatars) on EA forums.
 
I've mentioned the player lock to him in the past, if you mean being unable to change player. I also covered this 1v1 business, especially 1v1 heading.
 
Yeah I might not be very clear with what I mean, but it is the 1v1 business. Anyone close to the ball should be able to try to attack it, be it trying to head it or trying to shoot or whatever.

When you play only 1 player against the CPU, your own AI must help you out a little too by jumping to try to head the ball on corners since you can only control one player. PES always had this and it was great. FIFA 10 did take a step in the right direction when implementing that your team mates try to block shots, they need to do the same with headers if they want the game to play out realistic.

Edit: The most annoying thing for me at the moment is that the drop kicks from the keeper always ends up at the same spot. If you control the keeper yourself you can aim left and right too, but still it always ends up in the same spot (left spot, centre spot or right spot). The CPU keeper always kicks out to the centre spot. I think the only time the CPU keeper throws (rolls) out the ball is when for some reason a defender is behind him. Otherwise it is a kick to the exact same centre spot even if no players are there.

Just because you aim centre shouldn't mean that the ball should end up at the same spot all the time. They need to add a lot of random noise to the outcome not only in variation to left or right but also in length and height. And if there is no one up there, the keeper should not hoof it up.
 
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romagnoli said:
God the animations are appalling in the demo.
Click to expand...

They're appalling in the full game. However Jimmy G-Force may be of help if you want some video evidence.

I think the basic point is that in PES the AI team-mates will regularly make efforts to attack the ball whereas in Fifa they don't, it's generally only the player in your control that can affect the play.
 
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Another thing that'd be a good idea in the tactics section would be for the 'assign role' options to be much more detailed. Dunno about last year's but FM2010 lets you define a role in a formation as more than just MC, AMC etc. You can assign deep lying playmakers, box-to-box midfielders, ball-winning midfielders etc. Similarly you can distinguish between a deep lying forward, a target man, a complete forward, a poacher and a defensive forward.

The point is that in MM you should be able to search for people whose stats and traits suit this role. You should also be able to see who in your squad suits these roles best, possibly by skewing the hexagon. It should also automatically assign defensive and attacking work rates and runs accordingly, making the whole formation setup a lot more user friendly.
 
There was a screenshot released before PES 2010 was out I believe where 4 Liverpool players jumped and tried to head a ball on a corner.

Good idea though, I'm thinking of installing PES just to try to record some videos to highlight the beauty of not having player lock limit (1v1) in the game.

Edit:

Some videos from corners in PES 2010 I just recorded:

YouTube - pes2010 2010-02-23 17-16-48-54.mp4
Comments:
A 2vs2 situation where everyone is trying to head the ball, even my CPU team mate. In FIFA I think it is safe to say that it would have locked on to the black guy (my CPU team mate) and would have resulted in the defender heading the ball out of the box because he got behind him. But because there is no lock limit in PES I could cancel my way there and even if I didn't win the challenge, I still got the ball left in the box because the defender headed the ball into my guys head.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zimtb8og7C4
Comments:
Here is a nice 4vs2 situation. Once again everyone is trying to get to the ball. I'm in green shirts and controlling the left player. My CPU team mate is also helping me out and doesn't just stand around like in FIFA.

This situation also show the great advantage you have when you outnumber your opposition. These four defenders are making it really hard for my two guys to get in and challenge for the ball. Since there is a 1vs1 player lock limit in FIFA, this situation in FIFA would be that one of my guys could easily get into position for a header because there would only be one defender to challenge, the others would move to the side.


YouTube - pes2010 2010-02-23 17-34-15-46.mp4
Comments:
I kind of like this video because it shows that almost every player can get involved in tight situations. It's a little bit unrealistic because everyone is going for the ball and doesn't care about the players around them, but still.

Again it shows the advantage for the defenders. Even if I did get a header on the ball I would probably head it on a defender and not straight at goal. Kind of looks like how a corner would look in real life in the last seconds in a game where everyone is going 100%.


YouTube - pes2010 2010-02-23 17-36-23-33.mp4
Comments:
This again shows how important it is for everyone close to the ball to be able to make a challenge. The reason the ball didn't end up in the net was because the guy closest to goal could also jump and try to head it. I won the header but hit him in the head.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hqVDt7QbYaM
Comments:
Not much more to say about this. Shows another corner where a lot of people are involved. I think it looks pretty good, even the two first guys (one from each team, both CPU players) try to reach the ball even if they clearly are not close enough (just like you would do in real life too).


YouTube - pes2010 2010-02-23 17-42-49-62.mp4
Comments:
And finally a video of me defending a corner. I am the black guy that heads the ball away. Notice how my CPU team mates act. They are helping me out by trying to head the ball too. So if I had been in a little worse position and missed the ball, they would have covered for me. This is realistic behaviour and this can't happen in FIFA because of the lock limit.
 
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Nerf's post is one of the best structured posts I've read about how to face some of the Fifa problems. Congrats to him!

I would add something that specially makes me angry:

How should barging the ball and shielding work
One of the problems why tackling and pressure are overdone in the game is the fact that skill and positioning do nothing in barging / physical clash situations.

It's impossible to shield the ball with Xavi while walking if someone throws a strong player against him (and even less strong players would do I fear). In real world, Xavi can shield the ball to any oncoming player because of his positioning and technique. This is blatantly needed in the game.

Right now the game has a specific "shielding" button that you can press when you are standing still.

I propose they get rid of this button. Shielding should be done automatically depending on the position, strength and technique of the player, even if it's walking.

For instance, if someone comes running towards my player but I turno the other way, the oncoming player should be denied the ball, and if he runs against my player, a foul should be given (and even a card for running to my back). My player, given the skill, should automatically shield the ball when the impact is done, allowing me to then turn and go away with the ball.

Right now, it doens't matter where you're facing, an oncoming player will take the ball and put throw you to the floor simply by running or pressing "tackle" desperately.

Including this in the game would allow for a more tactical game. People wouldn't go mad at someone like Xavi because the chances of winning the ball are scarce.

Ball control:
Related to the previous post, I dig further on skill impact.

Strength is overdone in the game while skill doesn't make a real impact not only in passing but also in controlling the ball.

Trapping the ball, as well as running with the ball should be based on skill. If a player is 20 speed (to use 1-20 scale) but 5 skill, he should even loose the ball a little and mistouch it when sprinting. This is yet to be seen in a football game and is the main reason why in the real world speedy players doesn't automatically earn 1 vs 1 all the time. Skill is needed to run with the ball. Ronaldo and Messi have an incredible control of the ball at full pelt, but Giuly or Lennon can't control the ball so well and many times mistouch it a little or loose the direction they were going. Not to mention worse players.

Running with the ball could also be controlled with the pad. If you touch the sprint button when the player touches the ball, you get better control for the next meters, while, touching it too late or too soon would produce worse ball control. That would work and completely change the way people runs with the ball, and would reward the player skill stats and you skill as a player with the pad.

Trapping needs something similar. Trapping is what differentiates more the good and the bad players. Being able to perfectly control an ongoing ball should rely heavily on player stats. Some button could be added too to try to improve the trapping. Pes has done something about it though it should be much better.

That's it by now. These are my major concerns once Nerf's has nailed the rest.
 
These are good suggestions guys, keep them coming.

I've passed these on as well. Gary replied last night, thanking us for the info. He's seen your defensive post (the one I re-sent) before, nerf, and I've read elsewhere that he was disappointed that the issues at the back made it into the final game.

It'll be interesting to see what EA take from our suggestions. A lot of it will depend on whether they choose to separate arcade and sim, for me. Besides time and technical restrictions (which are of course pretty significant!), I can't see how EA can make the hardcore and the casuals equally happy without drawing a big line in the sand between them.

Drekkard, I'd certainly like to see timing and player skill be more important for right stick dribbling and control, if nothing else. Timing should be more a part of the game as a whole as well - a player-controlled factor that can make the difference between those perfect dipping volleys FIFA is chock full of, and the skied/sliced horrors that you'd see in real life 99% of the time.
 
I must admit feeling skeptical about this. These ideas are great but the rather harsh things I’ve said about ea are the reasons for my skeptical approach. Do EA really need to make this game realistic? Because FIFA 10 made a killing with it's gameplay despite all its errors.

Because on the forums (my name is Klashnekoff nth on there) The harsh criticism i can see why EA have simply turned a blind eye to my views but i don't want to send EA tons of ideas like I have in the past only for them to pretty much ignore them. I do believe that Romagnoli is right that EA MUST! Draw the line in terms of arcade and simulation if they are to progress with a realistic game.

You have all made great points about the gameplay, most points i have already made. So my input here will be on the graphics especially player models which are rather poor to say the least!


1. Improving player models/graphics.
What annoys me the most is EA's first effort on the Xbox 360(FIFA RTWC) and the following World cup 2006 game are STILL! 5 years after being released has by far the best player models! On par or even better than PES 2010! Shirts moved and rippled organically, shirt presentation and numbers were correctly proportioned and players actually had shoulders unlike in FIFA 09 and 10.
Egdar Davids, looks brilliant in this picture here:
1128346857.jpg


FIFA 10's models are too skinny in general, they seemingly have no shoulders and appear more like cartoon caricatures. Just going backwards directly to FIFA 06 in terms of the player models (not player heads) would be a massive step up. Look at Xavi here:
xavi_1-500x281.jpg


See more evidence here on FIFA 06 far superior graphics in terms of kit’s and player models.
http://uk.gamespot.com/xbox360/spor...-06-road-to-fifa-world-cup-official-trailer-2
http://www.videogametalk.com/images/reviews/30/1139857551.jpg
http://i.testfreaks.com/images/products/600x400/26/fifa-2006-road-to-fifa-world-cup.642074.jpg
http://reviews.cnet.com/xbox-360-ga...7-31414817-3.html?tag=contentBody;screenshots
http://i.testfreaks.com/images/products/600x400/26/fifa-2006-road-to-fifa-world-cup.642074.jpg
http://images.google.co.uk/imgres?i...a=N&rls=org.mozilla:en-GB:official&tbs=isch:1
http://uk.gamespot.com/xbox360/spor...fa-06-road-to-fifa-world-cup-gameplay-movie-5

Also the better and far more realistic player cut scenes and ‘quick tactics’ you can see pop up in the bottom video are tow things I would look to see put back in the game.
 
In addition to what's been said...

- Accurately implement the offside rule into the game. I can honestly say that whilst playing Clubs online our team has conceded (and scored) hundreds of blatant offside goals.

The biggest culprit is the situation where a player is through on goal, he slows down and waits for his team mate to join him, then he passes the ball in front of his team mate, who then taps it in. That is offside! What makes it worse is that (e.g.) five minutes into the game the linesman will correctly put up his flag but later on in the game he refuses to when the same situation repeats itself

Last night the same thing happened and there were three players offside, of course the goal wasn't disallowed. :BRICK:

- Fix the positioning of the referee, they get in the way too much and the commentators always mention it...feels scripted.

- Come up with a way to sort out the weaker foot accuracy/frequency of each player, it's very, very frustrating.

- One of the things I loved about ISS on the PS2 was the dribbling, it was simple to use but deadly when done appropriately (PES6 still has the best dribbling in a football game IMO). In FIFA a simple move like a step over is so convoluted to perform. In ISS it's simple, you tap :r2: once, twice or three times, naturally skilled players are better than the Gary Neville's of this world. However in FIFA Neville can give Elia (LW) broken ankles, it's unrealistic.

- Defensively 09 and 10 are the worst football games I've played and the biggest issue is that the AI has no awareness.

I'll be playing Clubs online and being ANY, the opposition are on the counter attack, I'm controlling a CB and marking one the of forwards. Commons sense would tell the AI CB to mark the space and stick with the other forward but instead they always come over and attempt a double team with me. We all know what happens next, it's as if they are attracted to the ball and nothing else.

- Sort out the manual player switching, it never switches to the player in the best position (closest to the ball). When it happens in SP, it constantly feels like the game is favouring the CPU. When the ball is loose in the midfield it's annoying when the game repeatedly mocks you by ignoring your AI team mate that is two metres away from the ball. Instead it'll change the cursor to your CB who is twenty yards further back. Of course this brings the CB miles out of position and leaves another gaping hole in the defence.
 
tobi said:
Accurately implement the offside rule into the game. I can honestly say that whilst playing Clubs online our team has conceded (and scored) hundreds of blatant offside goals.

The biggest culprit is the situation where a player is through on goal, he slows down and waits for his team mate to join him, then he passes the ball in front of his team mate, who then taps it in. That is offside!
Click to expand...

Im pretty sure that isnt offside as the player is behind the ball. If the player is ahead of the ball and you pass it to him then that would be offside.

I think the offside rule has been implemented fairly well in FIFA 10, and I would actually like to see it like in real football where sometimes the linesman gets it wrong. Though this would be hard to do without pissing folk off too much, but if you want an accurate footy sim we need crappy refs and assistants :)
 
I didn't explain it well, the team mate is ahead of the ball when the ball is played to him.
 
Best thing is if you could upload videos from those offside goals so that EA (and the rest of us) can see what is going on.
 
That would be hard to do because the replays online rarely play out in full.

The guys on here that play on the same team have seen it happen on a nightly basis.
 
nerf said:
Passing is but one facet. Why would a good or bad player be defined solely by his passing accuracy when there's 999 other aspects that make him the player he is? Manual controls don't affect his Marking, his Acceleration, his Balance etc etc.

Besides, I don't believe for a moment that the concepts of manual controls and player individualisation are mutually exclusive. Manual passing (for example) should be affected by the individual's passing accuracy, by their weaker foot rating if applicable, by their general consistency level, and so on. These individual factors can be included... but first you need to have some individualisation at all. FIFA doesn't have that regardless of the control scheme.

The 'craze for fully manual', for me at least, is what Jimmy G-Force described. The test of skill, the reward, the satisfaction. It provides more of a challenge to overcome. I can't stomach PES or assisted FIFA any more, it's too pedestrian in comparison.
Click to expand...

Gotta say that this is about where I stand on manual controls. It's the best we've got at the moment simply because there's room for human error but by no means can they be considered realistic, as romagnoli said.

Just one question regarding the manual controls in FIFA 10 though? I may be a bit late in coming to this realization but I've noticed a few times that while the people that I played against do make quite a few mistakes if they're not used to playing manual, there are times when they'll seemingly hold down the A(O) button and smash a long pass that seems to "home in" on one of their players.

What I mean to say is that it feels like with FIFA 10 that the manual passing is not quite as manual as it was in the past two games. For me personally I'm used to it so I pretty much have no issues with it (with the exception of passing in tight quarters, and that's pretty much due to the pressure), but I've noticed more than a few randoms who I've duped into playing on manual via the online lobbies (the only way I can really get a game) who seem to be waaaaaay too accurate with their passing. It could be the case that I'm getting paired up with guys who just HAPPEN to know how to play manual but I've even seen it when I play myself. A pass in a player's general vicinity but not directly to them will see the player seemingly "activate" and slide over to receive the pass instead of the way it was in FIFA 08 where you would need to select that player and go get the ball.

I could be way off base, but it feels like they've made manual passing a bit less manual in FIFA 10.

*I am incapable of not making super long-winded posts.
 
I would like to see weather effect the game.I know it has been mentioned but they should apply it to different countries.Western Europe should have the dry hot & dry period in august September,and as the months move on the pitches get worse.Eastern Europe should have the colder heavier pitches.African stadiums should have the drier not so well kept pitches just like South-America.I would like to see wear & tear as in Madden and as the pitch gets worse it effects how the ball moves.Plus kits getting dirty.Yes i am a graphic junkie but these things should be in a game that has made so much money so far.All this shit about the art department not having time to make proper kits..Bullshit,do it right or don't do it at all.
 
Gameplay is the most important thing, but I would focus on add ons to the game that keep it fresh over a year.

Having the EPL and La Liga license how come EA cant have a DLC stadium pack for the EPL and La Liga. 5 bucks each, and you get every team a stadium, after playing in the same stadiums in MM for a while it gets a little tedious. Or for Fifa 11, why not have WC stadium pack, so that we can download the WC stadiums, they are already made for the WC game and well you did all that art job for that one game that lasts 5 months. Might as well keep that art alive and lets us be able to download. Over time you can creat alot of stadiums and by fifa 2013 we could have, a Stadium packs for the top 4 Euro leagues, an International Stadium pack plus the stadiums that already come by default in the game.

Editing, let us edit kits in MM. I hate being three seasons in w/ the same kits. I understand that there are restrictions, but is it possible, and hear me out, that we can edit a kit's style. I will use Barcelona as an example. We can Edit barcelona kits in Nike templates of their kits, we cant remove the nike logo of the Barcelona shirt and we can't remove the sponsor (Unicef in this case) and we can move around the Team emblem on the front of the Shirt. So then we can edit alot of stuff on the kits on MM and have fresh new kits for new seasons. Let us do so for every team in MM, that way if we want we can edit every team in our league so we see them use new kits every season when they play my team.

There are a butt load of players that dont have faces in FIFA, let us edit those, lets use the fifa servers to insert them, like we do with our virtual pro. We could have alot of more player faces in the game.

Now, more into the game. Ive noticed that the Camera angles fifa uses are really cinematic in the cut scenes and replays. I think that helps PES give you that simulation feeling because it feels like TV. In Fifa cutscenes the players are not even near where they are standing when the game was stopped, let it all be continouos so that it feels like real life. Camera angles for celebrations should also be like a camera on the stands, not those super upclose shots from below the player, as if the cameraman was on the pitch.

The kits well, we all know whats wrong, get them right. Take advantage of the community in this respect. Many community members would be willing to help with this.

Again I know gameplay is more important, but this things can help keep a game fresh over a year.
 
This is a bloody good thread:

http://forums.electronicarts.co.uk/...60/925969-idea-fifa11s-passing-system-rd.html


The main idea from the OP, which has been discussed and debated for several pages without any idiots interfering, is that, for assisted controls (which will have been fixed to have some error!), if you try to pass backwards, the pass will be manual (we've since agreed that there should also be some error or restriction to stop people turning away from the action to hit a perfect manual through ball etc). The amount of assistance varies based on the quality of the players involved.


rDarkchild said:
Hey there people,
Just updating this thread with Consolidating Information.

I made some images that hopefully would make it easier for people to understand my original post a bit more clearly.

Plus I have added my Idea about Throughballs below. Hope you guys think it's OK. Please discuss.

And I am glad someone at EA read this thread. Hopefully it would be taken on board.

=========================

Anyway,

Below is an example of a Diminishing-Computer-Assisted-Passing Ring or DCAP Ring for Ground (X Button) and Lofted ( [] Button) Passes. This is a top down view where the player is facing upwards.

rDGroundLoftedPassingSystem-4STAR.jpg


The above surrounds each player. The red part is where Passes that leave the ball carrier in that range of directions.. are fully assisted by the computer. The orange range is semi-assisted by the Computer and the yellow range is completely manual (no Computer assistance regarding direction).

The above DCAP Ring is for a player who has a 4 STAR Pass Rating (Possibly inline with with his 4 STAR Skill Rating. Although these systems should be independent).

Anyway, the following are supplementary examples of DCAP Rings for a range of Pass Ratings.

Ronaldinho below:
rDGroundLoftedPassingSystem-6STAR.jpg


A Goal Keeper Possibly:
rDGroundLoftedPassingSystem-1STAR.jpg


John Terry:
rDGroundLoftedPassingSystem-3STAR.jpg


-----------------------------------------
Effects on the Game

Hopefully a reduction (not total eradication) in Ping-Pong Passing. Yet keeping the games passing flow (with forward facing passes).

Boosting the illusion of Individuality. I believe that gamers will be able to feel the difference between Ronaldinho/Xavi/Fabregas and Terry/Bramble/Cech/Barthez - in terms of passing comfort. The way you feel the difference with Passing setting being on Assisted and the settings being on Manual.

I believe it will increase Realism/Similuation - without sacrificing too much of the Pick Up 'n' Play aspects we all know and love about football games like FIFA.

It Rewards those who are skilled with Manual Controls. These people will probably be able to ping pong still (but it will need precisely that.. skill, to do it).

I'm no expert, but relying more on human error will mean less code will be needed to add Artificial error to passes (though it is still needed here and there). A opportunity for Human error also gives rise for Human skill manisfest on the pitch. Less Bad AI in the way could lead to a reduction in frustration at Computer. And more at ourselves (which is the best frustration hehe)..

=========================

Here is my other idea that focus on the Through - Ball pass.

How many times have you seen John Terry throughballed it to Drogba or Anelka with stunning accuracy/annoyance. Don't get me wrong - it's possible in real life. But football games just don't replicate the real life inconsistency of that happening.

Below is a diagram illustrating someone doing a long range through-ball (green-yellow bar) with John Terry. But the accuracy/conduct of that pass is once again determined by Diminishing Support from the Computer.

rDThrough-BallPassingSystem-3STAR.jpg


The longer you hold the Triangle Button with Terry the more 'Manual' that pass is. Thus the more skill required from the gamer to pull off those wonderful through balls.

Don't get it twisted though, Terry can through ball with ease like any other player other a short range.

Here are some other examples of players maxing out through ball passes.

Pirlo:
rDThrough-BallPassingSystem-6STAR.jpg


Here you can see that Pirlo is fully assisted over the entire range of the pass.

A Random GoalKeeper:

rDThrough-BallPassingSystem-1STAR.jpg


Basically don't try to throughball with the keeper over long ranges hehe.

-----------------------------------------

This throughball idea can be simplified if need be.
Where 1 and 2 STAR throughballers can use the 2 STAR Range.

3 and 4 star share the 4 star range.

and 5 and 6 star throughballers are both fully assisted.

-----------------------------------------

EFFECT ON THE GAME

Reliance more on the gifted passers to play forwards in with wonderful/perfect/banana passes. Adding once again to the illusion of Individuality in the game.

Midfield play will be re-established in football game series.

This could lead to reduction in reliance/abuse of 4-2-4 formations of even 6-0-4 formations.

Due to the nature of Manual Through Ball passes - which basically do not curve the way they do for assisted throughball passes; Only people like Kaka (See his mesmerising through ball to Crespo in the 2005 Champions league Final) can do Banana throughballs over long ranges.

=========================
END
Click to expand...
 
Gcooley also suggested that we have a lot more control over the player receiving a pass; the idea being that, since passing will need you to be well positioned to hit an accurate ball, you can adjust your positioning accordingly. It's much the same as adjusting yourself to hit a volley instead of a header in PES, except you should be able to do it all the time in order to fine tune and get the best out of the game.

I've copied in what I've posted about it over there, as it's hard to explain.
HandOfBeadle said:
The point is that your positioning dictates your orientation, which will always be towards the ball unless you are supercancelling.

Watch this vid of Paul Scholes.

YouTube - Paul Scholes: Control, Touches, Passing


There are a few examples, if you know what you are looking for. Watch the pass he receives in 1:47 as a prime example; he could have taken that first touch back towards his defence and then turned around, but in the time that would have taken the passing option forward would most likely have gone, or he would have been harried by the midfielder (Davies?), meaning he'd really have to play the ball back to someone in defence. Alternatively he could have made sure his first touch was towards goal, therefore having to turn his body and follow the ball, potentially giving Davies time to win the ball.

Instead, what Scholes does is stop the ball dead, instead moving his body so that he is facing north-west, so his 'DCAP' is perfectly aimed at the left wing, the ball isn't any closer to Davies, and he has time to look at his options.

That example is perhaps a little bit close to just using the relevant shoulder buttons to face goal to fully convince people. Instead, how about 3:30 - Evra passes to Scholes, Scholes then actively lets the ball run across him and steps back so he can hit a long ball to the opposite flank. If he had taken a touch forwards and tried it, he would be splattered by the Stoke midfielder (who, you can see, is right up on him by the time he hits the ball). If he had just hit it first time without adjusting it would have been on his weaker left foot and he would have had an entirely different DCAP available.

All of this, I think, can be done with just the left stick, with things like letting the ball actively roll past you being perhaps sprint and the direction the ball is rolling.

Maybe you could use a button to actively unlock yourself from the ball, but I haven't quite thought which button! I personally think pressing a button would make it less intuitive and organic than it should be, but it depends how well it works out as a default action.

Supercancel would be the obvious bet - tap supercancel to unlock and then you free your player up. Otherwise I don't know. I'm currently thinking R1 will be dummy the ball in all situations so it won't be that. I'd quite like to see L1 (I've not got my footy games confused have I?) let you turn to face goal, but you shouldn't stop the ball dead as you currently do. There are a lot of examples in that video of Scholes dragging his foot over the ball so he turns and faces goal, but also moving the ball away from the defenders, buying himself time (see 1:10). Maybe players with good ball control should be able to do this, while less gifted players are left having to take a touch and then turn around, or with L1 they can only stop the ball on the spot. R2 is sprint, so that's a no.

L2, then, seems like a decent bet if you want a button, instantly giving you either close control from your first touch. Dunno, I haven't thought about buttons too much as I'd kind of want it to be the default option, but that may not be as feasible as I think it is.
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Well Gary did actually post the following in the thread I took those from, and I have been sending ideas on from here via PMs.

EA_GaryPaterson said:
Hey Guys,

Just wanted to drop a note to say that I have read this (or actually am in the process of reading, have not read everything). Ping pong passing is something that we are trying to do something about this year so rest assured that we are listening to this type of feedback.

Love the constructive thread.

Cheers,

Gary
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Did anybody manage to put our contributions in this thread to that thread in the ea site? I know the chances of having our gameplay petitions addressed are minimal, but it's great if they hear you, at least.
 
romagnoli said:
Well Gary did actually post the following in the thread I took those from, and I have been sending ideas on from here via PMs.
Click to expand...

Hey Guys,

Just wanted to drop a note to say that I have read this (or actually am in the process of reading, have not read everything). Ping pong passing is something that we are trying to do something about this year so rest assured that we are listening to this type of feedback.

Love the constructive thread.

Cheers,

Gary
Click to expand...

:PRAY: Please let this be true.
 
drekkard said:
Did anybody manage to put our contributions in this thread to that thread in the ea site? I know the chances of having our gameplay petitions addressed are minimal, but it's great if they hear you, at least.
Click to expand...

I might do that, actually. As I said, I've put your ideas through to Gary, but it might be an idea to give them an airing with that same group of people.
 
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