PGA Tour 2K23 [PS4/PS5/XB1/XBSX/PC]

Chris Davies

Chris Davies

Chief PESsimist
Staff
14 May 2003
UK
Tranmere Rovers
pga-tour-2k23-xbox-one-xbox-one-game-microsoft-store-europe-cover.jpg


Publisher: 2K
Developer: 2K
Website: pgatour.2k.com
Genre: Sports
Player(s): Up to 4 locally, many online
System(s): PS4, PS5, Xbox One, Xbox Series S, Xbox Series X, PC
Release Date: October 14th 2022



Well... I wasn't looking forward to this. I wasn't a huge fan of 2K21, which IMO made way too many realism sacrifices to try and bring in the EA crowd (Rory McIlroy PGA Tour was the easiest, silliest golf game I've ever played).

There were some core issues in 2K21 that never seemed to be considered for fixing, and there was so much silence from the devs that when they suddenly started advertising 2K23, it felt like an insult. "We didn't care what you thought for two years but make sure you buy our new game!"

Well, with other sports games letting me down hugely this year, I thought I'd give it a go.

I'll be damned if I'm not having an absolute blast with this.

I'm not sure if swings on the Xbox controller are just harder than the PlayStation (where I last played), but I have to be super, super focused just to hit a straight shot on the default difficulty (that's really important to me - play offline or online and by default it's a realistic, very difficult but incredibly satisfying grind).

They've added gear with various buffs and an RPG-style skill tree, which was a huge red flag to me - "it's going to get super easy when I've unlocked everything", I thought. But... It's actually really innovative (I've not known another game that does it like this).

Rather than the buffs give you increased shot distance or accuracy all the time, they only kick in when you meet certain conditions - and they tend to be "bad" conditions, not "good" conditions - i.e...

...you only get the benefit of the buffs when you're playing like shit (or, at best, okay). For example, miss the fairway from a drive three times in a row, and your fourth drive will get a slight accuracy boost. Is it me, or is that absolutely genius? It means you're never really overpowered, and if you are, it's not for very long.

I've put in 10+ hours so far (believe me, that's unusual for me) and I'm not seeing many negatives. It's punishingly difficult (if you don't choose to make it easier), the AI is great (and customisable at an overall level - there are some sliders for things like the AI's day-to-day score variation during a tournament)... I mean, the graphics are fairly poor (due to all the courses being built with the equivalent of LEGO parts), and the commentary is wrong nearly all the time ("this putt to get into the top 5 of the leaderboard", when it takes me to 24th)... But who cares about that.

So yeah, I'm really impressed! I'm just hoping they don't back down from this vision via updates, which is easy to imagine when people complain (as I've already seen) that it's "impossible to score well".

I was really looking forward to EA's golf game given that it's got the Masters licensing etc. but now I've played this, I can't imagine they would ever, ever make such a serious sim-based sports game.
 
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  • #3
Placebo said:
Might have to check this out, so there's no online MP at all? Bit surprising.
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Oh no, there is multiplayer! I've not tried online play to be honest, because I suspect that everyone else is miraculously getting silly scores (which instantly spoils it for me).

I was just saying that the default controls / difficulty, both offline and online, is hellishly difficult (but satisfying as hell). It's not like you go online and suddenly everyone is on assisted settings - to use those, you have to create custom (non-ranked) games.

It's almost like FIFA suddenly saying "the game is fully-manual by default now, if you want to play assisted you'll have to use our new lobby system". I don't think that would suit football (I'd rather attributes took a lot of my control away), but golf... It feels right to me!

Annoyingly, I've just read a few reviews, and they all tend to say the same thing (especially IGN's review) - "this is a stuffy, bland, impossibly difficult game that needs more 'fun' to it", and I couldn't disagree more. There have been millions of arcade golf games with birdie-every-hole scoring.
 
Chris Davies said:
Oh no, there is multiplayer! I've not tried online play to be honest, because I suspect that everyone else is miraculously getting silly scores (which instantly spoils it for me).

I was just saying that the default controls / difficulty, both offline and online, is hellishly difficult (but satisfying as hell). It's not like you go online and suddenly everyone is on assisted settings - to use those, you have to create custom (non-ranked) games.

It's almost like FIFA suddenly saying "the game is fully-manual by default now, if you want to play assisted you'll have to use our new lobby system". I don't think that would suit football (I'd rather attributes took a lot of my control away), but golf... It feels right to me!

Annoyingly, I've just read a few reviews, and they all tend to say the same thing (especially IGN's review) - "this is a stuffy, bland, impossibly difficult game that needs more 'fun' to it", and I couldn't disagree more. There have been millions of arcade golf games with birdie-every-hole scoring.
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Oh Chris, I've just got Victoria 3, why are you doing this? 😀
I was about to skip this one exclusively based on Steam reviews (yes I know they're getting more and more unreliable). I think I'll purchase it if it goes on sale in the festive season.
 
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fear said:
Oh Chris, I've just got Victoria 3, why are you doing this? 😀
I was about to skip this one exclusively based on Steam reviews (yes I know they're getting more and more unreliable). I think I'll purchase it if it goes on sale in the festive season.
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Let's see if they patch the game to make it 10x easier before then, I have a bad feeling.

(Also, I really want Victoria 3 too...)
 
Chris Davies said:
pga-tour-2k23-xbox-one-xbox-one-game-microsoft-store-europe-cover.jpg


Publisher: 2K
Developer: 2K
Website: pgatour.2k.com
Genre: Sports
Player(s): Up to 4 locally, many online
System(s): PS4, PS5, Xbox One, Xbox Series S, Xbox Series X, PC
Release Date: October 14th 2022



Well... I wasn't looking forward to this. I wasn't a huge fan of 2K21, which IMO made way too many realism sacrifices to try and bring in the EA crowd (Rory McIlroy PGA Tour was the easiest, silliest golf game I've ever played).

There were some core issues in 2K21 that never seemed to be considered for fixing, and there was so much silence from the devs that when they suddenly started advertising 2K23, it felt like an insult. "We didn't care what you thought for two years but make sure you buy our new game!"

Well, with other sports games letting me down hugely this year, I thought I'd give it a go.

I'll be damned if I'm not having an absolute blast with this.

I'm not sure if swings on the Xbox controller are just harder than the PlayStation (where I last played), but I have to be super, super focused just to hit a straight shot on the default difficulty (that's really important to me - play offline or online and by default it's a realistic, very difficult but incredibly satisfying grind).

They've added gear with various buffs and an RPG-style skill tree, which was a huge red flag to me - "it's going to get super easy when I've unlocked everything", I thought. But... It's actually really innovative (I've not known another game that does it like this).

Rather than the buffs give you increased shot distance or accuracy all the time, they only kick in when you meet certain conditions - and they tend to be "bad" conditions, not "good" conditions - i.e...

...you only get the benefit of the buffs when you're playing like shit (or, at best, okay). For example, miss the fairway from a drive three times in a row, and your fourth drive will get a slight accuracy boost. Is it me, or is that absolutely genius? It means you're never really overpowered, and if you are, it's not for very long.

I've put in 10+ hours so far (believe me, that's unusual for me) and I'm not seeing many negatives. It's punishingly difficult (if you don't choose to make it easier), the AI is great (and customisable at an overall level - there are some sliders for things like the AI's day-to-day score variation during a tournament)... I mean, the graphics are fairly poor (due to all the courses being built with the equivalent of LEGO parts), and the commentary is wrong nearly all the time ("this putt to get into the top 5 of the leaderboard", when it takes me to 24th)... But who cares about that.

So yeah, I'm really impressed! I'm just hoping they don't back down from this vision via updates, which is easy to imagine when people complain (as I've already seen) that it's "impossible to score well".

I was really looking forward to EA's golf game given that it's got the Masters licensing etc. but now I've played this, I can't imagine they would ever, ever make such a serious sim-based sports game.
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Hey Chris,
I really loved to read your comment about the new game.👍

let me ask you just one question: is the ball travel to the left and right (hook/slice) still dependent on how fast you downswing?
i did not like that gameplay element at all!
 
PRO_TOO said:
let me ask you just one question: is the ball travel to the left and right (hook/slice) still dependent on how fast you downswing?
i did not like that gameplay element at all!
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Not "dependent" (you can pull left/right depending on your stick/mouse motion), but yes, a fast downswing will send your ball to the left (my biggest issue), and a slow downswing will send it to the right.

kamy100 said:
Well if @Chris Davies is impressed by a sports game then I am deffo going to have to check it out.
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I saw a review that calls it "the Elden Rings of golf games" and I completely agree with that. However, they then go on to tear it apart because it's far too hard to be consistent... But I would argue, if that's what you want, play EA's golf games (Rory McIlroy is still available).
 
Chris Davies said:
Not "dependent" (you can pull left/right depending on your stick/mouse motion), but yes, a fast downswing will send your ball to the left (my biggest issue), and a slow downswing will send it to the right.


I saw a review that calls it "the Elden Rings of golf games" and I completely agree with that. However, they then go on to tear it apart because it's far too hard to be consistent... But I would argue, if that's what you want, play EA's golf games (Rory McIlroy is still available).
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Thanks pal. As good as your first review sounded, I think I can’t go with that. It’s a kinda dealbreaker for me. 🤷‍♂️
 
PRO_TOO said:
Thanks pal. As good as your first review sounded, I think I can’t go with that. It’s a kinda dealbreaker for me. 🤷‍♂️
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If I'm not mistaken and if the difficulty is putting you off, you have a lot of options to customize the difficulty to suit your style of play and make it more fun and easier for you. You can go with the 3 click-swing mechanic also.
Given the fact you're a mostly offline player you can have fun with the game I guess.
 
fear said:
If I'm not mistaken and if the difficulty is putting you off, you have a lot of options to customize the difficulty to suit your style of play and make it more fun and easier for you. You can go with the 3 click-swing mechanic also.
Given the fact you're a mostly offline player you can have fun with the game I guess.
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It’s not the difficulty, I applaud that decision!
it’s the fact that hooks and slices are tied to this!
Tiger Woods had it nailed down, afair. a couple of years ago… that nonesense was introduced. For me it is. Maybe I have no clue about golf. 🤷‍♂️😊

and no, I don’t want 3 click or similar. I want to swing with the sticks!! As manual and as difficult as the real sport! Gimme bogeys, gimme out of bounds… but let me work for my first birdie. 😊 Chris said it so well!!
 
fear said:
If I'm not mistaken and if the difficulty is putting you off, you have a lot of options to customize the difficulty to suit your style of play and make it more fun and easier for you. You can go with the 3 click-swing mechanic also.
Given the fact you're a mostly offline player you can have fun with the game I guess.
Click to expand...
I think his issue is that, in reality, a fast swing doesn't always pull a shot to the left, or a slow swing to the right. (The pros have fast swings after all.)

I think this is a bit of a misconception about the game though, and I would argue that it's realistic. This mechanic is trying to represent your rhythm, not your power, and the two are separate.

Rhythm is the most important thing in golf, and if your rhythm is off, the punishment (in real-life) is a shot that will fly off left or right.

The pros swing fast but they maintain the correct bodily rhythm. If they throw that out (hips over-rotating etc.) because they're trying to stretch themselves (possibly with the psychological pressure), then the shot result WOULD BE what happens in the game. IMO.
 
PRO_TOO said:
It’s not the difficulty, I applaud that decision!
it’s the fact that hooks and slices are tied to this!
Tiger Woods had it nailed down, afair. a couple of years ago… that nonesense was introduced. For me it is. Maybe I have no clue about golf. 🤷‍♂️😊

and no, I don’t want 3 click or similar. I want to swing with the sticks!! As manual and as difficult as the real sport! Gimme bogeys, gimme out of bounds… but let me work for my first birdie. 😊 Chris said it so well!!
Click to expand...
In Tiger Woods though, with a fast swing adding power and a slow swing taking it away, your accuracy is always going to be crazily, unrealistically good. It's fairly easy to keep the stick forward/backward motion straight.

Golf is so much harder than that - it's not just whacking things in straight lines, hard or slow.

And the fact is, if a holder's rhythm messes up, they will fly left/right (and the system they have implemented is realistic in that regard).

In-fact, in real-life, I have the exact same issue I have in the game... I throw my hips as quickly towards the target as I can (and it's muscle memory so I have to REALLY fight it to stop it from happening), which means my rhythm is too fast, the club-head is straight before it gets to the ball and by the time it gets there, it's turning left, which sends the ball flying left.
 
Chris Davies said:
In Tiger Woods though, with a fast swing adding power and a slow swing taking it away, your accuracy is always going to be crazily, unrealistically good. It's fairly easy to keep the stick forward/backward motion straight.

Golf is so much harder than that - it's not just whacking things in straight lines, hard or slow.

And the fact is, if a holder's rhythm messes up, they will fly left/right (and the system they have implemented is realistic in that regard).

In-fact, in real-life, I have the exact same issue I have in the game... I throw my hips as quickly towards the target as I can (and it's muscle memory so I have to REALLY fight it to stop it from happening), which means my rhythm is too fast, the club-head is straight before it gets to the ball and by the time it gets there, it's turning left, which sends the ball flying left.
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So you are saying, me moaning about that feature for so long is plain wrong!? It’s a realistic way to transport the real stuff into a game?!

Edit: oh, just now read your answer towards fear. 👍
 
PRO_TOO said:
So you are saying, me moaning about that feature for so long is plain wrong!? It’s a realistic way to transport the real stuff into a game?!

Edit: oh, just now read your answer towards fear. 👍
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Well it's entirely personal opinion of course, but I would argue that the push/pull system in the game is representing your body rhythm (how your hips, shoulders etc. line up) - whereas every previous golf game has just been about power and how straight you can pull/push a stick.

Golf is way more complicated than that and I honestly think their tempo system is fantastic, and really hard to master (I've managed two "perfects" in a row at best).

Like I say, maybe it's just much harder on an Xbox controller than PlayStation (I played 2K21 on PS4/PS5)... But I'm really struggling, and I really have to concentrate. Just like real life*!

Put it like this - I had a shot yesterday with water on the left of the green. I know I pull everything left, my natural rhythm is "fast". So I aimed a long way right to make up for it... but the downswing is INCREDIBLY sensitive, and the pressure was too much (I was in the top 5 at this point). My downswing ended up being "very fast", pulling it a long way left, and just into the edge of the water.

That kind of thing happens to me regularly in real life - and I don't think many games capture just how damaging the psychology of pressure can be (or represent it so well by making the controls so hypersensitive to your input - you have to be P-E-R-F-E-C-T).

In older golf games, that wouldn't happen, because if you're fast/slow in those, all that changes is how far your shot goes (and pushing a stick back/forward in a straight line is fairly easy).

So yeah, I think it's an incredibly realistic way of doing it. But not everyone will have fun being absolutely shit at the game for their first 1,000 swings!

*And if I hit a terrible shot, I might just rush through the next 4-5 shots and totally destroy my whole round in a rage. Just like real life...
 
PRO_TOO said:
It’s not the difficulty, I applaud that decision!
it’s the fact that hooks and slices are tied to this!
Tiger Woods had it nailed down, afair. a couple of years ago… that nonesense was introduced. For me it is. Maybe I have no clue about golf. 🤷‍♂️😊

and no, I don’t want 3 click or similar. I want to swing with the sticks!! As manual and as difficult as the real sport! Gimme bogeys, gimme out of bounds… but let me work for my first birdie. 😊 Chris said it so well!!
Click to expand...
Oh ok. I thought you were finding the whole game difficult because of some mechanics tied to it. Yes, Chris is right and he explained it well.
Personally I'll go with Chris' advice and wait for a month or so before purchasing it. You never know if they'll ruin everything with a patch. In addition, because this game I think it's again tied to an always online method it will be impossible to revert back to a pre patch state.
 
fear said:
Oh ok. I thought you were finding the whole game difficult because of some mechanics tied to it. Yes, Chris is right and he explained it well.
Personally I'll go with Chris' advice and wait for a month or so before purchasing it. You never know if they'll ruin everything with a patch. In addition, because this game I think it's again tied to an always online method it will be impossible to revert back to a pre patch state.
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Yes. I’ll wait for sure.
Im all busy with the sim racing anyway.
 
Chris Davies said:
If you try to hit a splash shot out of the bunker, and it's not perfect - this is what awaits you... and I'm not joking... :LOL:

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Obviously the guy does it in purpose. I think after the 2nd try it would be easy for him to adjust/calculate the power and angle of the shot.
 
PRO_TOO said:
Did this title get an update yet? if so, how is the sim gameplay holding up? you know why I’m asking. 😊
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It's had an update, and it's had lots of very silly DLC (e.g. a putter head that looks like a taco)... But the gameplay is still nightmarishly difficult and mega satisfying on the default difficulty settings. Really enjoying it.
 
Chris Davies said:
It's had an update, and it's had lots of very silly DLC (e.g. a putter head that looks like a taco)... But the gameplay is still nightmarishly difficult and mega satisfying on the default difficulty settings. Really enjoying it.
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Thanks Chris
i was thinking about swapping it for FIFA23.

Edit: @Chris Davies , i bought it from the Black Friday offer.
first round q school ended +1 on pro am difficulty. I think I can control my skill issues much better in this one. So I plan ahead my too fast swings and account for wind… nice gameplay. 😊👏
 
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Thanks once more @Chris Davies !
It started with your first review here, that teased me in hope of a good golfing game.
now I’m trying to play par and it’s a joy to string together consecutive perfect swings!! 😍👏
The progress shenanigans ain’t mine but the gameplay looks more like it. The fast loading times really make it fun to go for a quick round.
It feels so much better than before, that I had no problem deleting the other 2 golf games I still had installed.
Let’s play each other one day!! 🥳

BABA BOOEY….!!! 😂

edit: I can get the swing tempo down much better now… and it’s fun to account skill issue into that and tinker with it. Lot of fun that is tonight. 😊👏
 
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I qualified for the PGA tour now. 👍
I did not spent any skill points or added club extras yet. All I did was giving my golfer a Nike glove. 🤷‍♂️

Ill go on with the basic player progression, without any boosts, for now…
Had an online 9hole vs. some random player. That was nice… also my first time I’m playing golf online vs. someone. I always played the AI or local multiplayer.
 
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