Microsoft Xbox

rojofa said:
Nice price to be able to play next-gen games, but it's disappointing to see a lower specced machine released.

Games will have to be developed so that they will be playable on the lowest specced platform. It could limit what developers can do if it's much less powerful than the XBSX/PS5, I hoped PS5 specs would be the baseline for next-gen game development.
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I absolutely agree.

Great news for casual gamers who just want a machine that lets them play the new games.

Sad news for hobbyist gamers who are sick of games being held back by antique hardware.

It's bad enough to imagine the PS5's hardware restrictions making cross-platform games less evolved. It's even worse when you realise there's the new "underpowered edition" consoles that your game needs to run on, too.
 
el niche said:
A bit under powered gpu and cpu, no disc drive. Guessing if you want the best 4k experience you go with X. But for people fine with 1080p and 1440p and aren't too worried about framerates, this is a great choice and entry point.

I wasn't considering any console, and am tied to playstation since the ps1, but at this price it could be an impulse buy.
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I don't know how current gen consoles handle resolution but difference between1080p vs1440p is visible enough compared to 1440p vs 4k at least on my 4k display. On most games, i have to sit less than 1.5 m to see the difference.

Anyway is the xbox 2S (Series S) :P has more graphic processing power compared to PS4 Pro/XoneX ?
 
I wouldn't worry about the lower spec machine.

Microsoft are building games using Direct X 12..

They have effectively just released 2 different spec PC's in essence.
One shouldn't neccesarily hold back the other, as the games will be built and then just tweaked for each console as if they were a PC.

The only downside potentially could be lack of AI development.
 
rojofa said:
Nice price to be able to play next-gen games, but it's disappointing to see a lower specced machine released.

Games will have to be developed so that they will be playable on the lowest specced platform. It could limit what developers can do if it's much less powerful than the XBSX/PS5, I hoped PS5 specs would be the baseline for next-gen game development.
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Chris Davies said:
I absolutely agree.

Great news for casual gamers who just want a machine that lets them play the new games.

Sad news for hobbyist gamers who are sick of games being held back by antique hardware.

It's bad enough to imagine the PS5's hardware restrictions making cross-platform games less evolved. It's even worse when you realise there's the new "underpowered edition" consoles that your game needs to run on, too.
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I don't think that would be the case. The way I look at it games will be developed to their potential (keep in mind games are also developed with a powerful PC platform in mind which I think would be the baseline, not PS5...). I think based on the hardware you the game will adjust. Games won't be underpowered. You have a PS5/PC/XBX? Then you get full 4K 60fps, you have a PC from 2018 (or lower-powered console)? You will have to adjust to not get ray-tracing/ lower fps/ not play in full 4K.

Current Flight simulator as an example, it can't run 4K in ultra in any available hardware, but I can run it in my 2017 PC... Does it mean the game was held back by old hardware? Not at all, my PC just wont have the same graphical fidelity.

Also, the new lowered specs consoles coming out are not toasters either... they are still pretty powerful machines...
 
el niche said:
I don't think that would be the case. The way I look at it games will be developed to their potential (keep in mind games are also developed with a powerful PC platform in mind which I think would be the baseline, not PS5...). I think based on the hardware you the game will adjust. Games won't be underpowered. You have a PS5/PC/XBX? Then you get full 4K 60fps, you have a PC from 2018 (or lower-powered console)? You will have to adjust to not get ray-tracing/ lower fps/ not play in full 4K.

Current Flight simulator as an example, it can't run 4K in ultra in any available hardware, but I can run it in my 2017 PC... Does it mean the game was held back by old hardware? Not at all, my PC just wont have the same graphical fidelity.

Also, the new lowered specs consoles coming out are not toasters either... they are still pretty powerful machines...
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That's pretty much the problem though.

Games won't be able to do more in terms of AI/physics stuff that is essential for the gameplay than can be done playably on the specs of the lowest platform it's aimed at - the number of things happening on screen, online player count, destruction/deformation, physics based characters etc... The lowering of that bar makes less of that kind of stuff a possibility for next-gen games.

I probably won't buy a console, but I wanted the bar for multi-platform games to be set as high as possible to see real progress in what games try to do. Playing the exact same games with or without ray tracing, or 4K instead of 1440p doesn't really bother me. I want games to progress beyond just adding more visual effects that can be turned off and still have the game be playable.

Maybe this Xbox is powerful enough to enable some of that progress, but not as much as if the PS5 was the lowest tier of specs.
 
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rojofa said:
That's pretty much the problem though.

Games won't be able to do more in terms of AI/physics stuff that is essential for the gameplay than can be done playably on the specs of the lowest platform it's aimed at - the number of things happening on screen, online player count, destruction/deformation, physics based characters etc... The lowering of that bar makes less of that kind of stuff a possibility for next-gen games.

I probably won't buy a console, but I wanted the bar for multi-platform games to be set as high as possible to see real progress in what games try to do. Playing the exact same games with or without ray tracing, or 4K instead of 1440p doesn't really bother me. I want games to progress beyond just adding more visual effects that can be turned off and still have the game be playable.

Maybe this Xbox is powerful enough to enable some of that progress, but not as much as if the PS5 was the lowest tier of specs.
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AH, point taken, I do however feel the physics/AI aspects wont suffer so much with such difference in power, again its not like the lowest denominator console is 1000 times less powerful. And things like: things happening on screen, online player count, destruction, physics based characters are already being adjusted depending on hardware (For example; Battelfield 3 could do online with 64 players on a PC, but on PS3 it would be just 32; you would see more particles and more detail in destructive environments in the PC, and that doesnt mean it was held back by the PS3, it was just reduced in accordance to the hardware).

I do get your point though, I just dont think you would see a big difference besides graphical improvements because one console had "insert number of teraflops" less than another (when the difference in power is not so big).

I think most of that power in the better consoles is to push better framerates and pixels, which is what we'll see in this generation, (thats what I think, at least given the games showcased which so far have been somewhat not really amazing as a leap forward)
 
Finally some price news. Very interested to see where PS4 price their diskless version now. And if it will be a "lesser" version in other aspects.
 
As far as i have understood correct, Sony does not have an equivalent Series S concept-version for PS, like PS4 LITE or PS5 LITE for example..Or does SLIM count as LITE version?
They had Ps4 the regural version, PS4pro the advanced version, so a Normal and a Superior, while Microsoft had a regular aka Xbox ONE, a superior Xbox ONE X and an inferior-to-superior Xbox ONE S.

And now Sony comes with a regular version PS5 and waiting in the future for a superior PS5pro, and maybe a SLIM aka LITE??? version, while MS comes from start with a regular version XBOX series X and an inferior version Xbox Series S, and maybe in the future they wil throw a PRO equivalent, maybe Xbox Series XX, or X-pro, or pro-X?

I mean the Series S concept does not have equivalent in PS5? Am i correct? OR am i confused? Or will be a possible SLIM version that? :P

P.S.: Sorry if i sound stupid.. :)
 
Or to ask it more simple: Lets assume we all make a party, and you who bought PS5 and Xbox series X are like joining the party with Champagne. If i buy an Xbox Series S, will it be like i joined the party with a can of beer bought from the local corner shop?
 
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el niche said:
AH, point taken, I do however feel the physics/AI aspects wont suffer so much with such difference in power, again its not like the lowest denominator console is 1000 times less powerful. And things like: things happening on screen, online player count, destruction, physics based characters are already being adjusted depending on hardware (For example; Battelfield 3 could do online with 64 players on a PC, but on PS3 it would be just 32; you would see more particles and more detail in destructive environments in the PC, and that doesnt mean it was held back by the PS3, it was just reduced in accordance to the hardware).

I do get your point though, I just dont think you would see a big difference besides graphical improvements because one console had "insert number of teraflops" less than another (when the difference in power is not so big).

I think most of that power in the better consoles is to push better framerates and pixels, which is what we'll see in this generation, (thats what I think, at least given the games showcased which so far have been somewhat not really amazing as a leap forward)
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They did make those changes for BF4 between PS3 and PC/PS4, but I really doubt they would make similar adjustments and seperate players/features between Xbox Series S and Series X... I can't imagine them saying for Xbox S players you have 64 player servers with less destruction and Xbox X on different 128 player servers with full destruction. They will just limit it overall to whatever Xbox S is capable of...

Maybe it's not a massive difference like that, I was just making a shot in the dark as an example, but it has set the bar lower in these aspects for what developers can do in multi-platform and Xbox exclusive games.
 
slamsoze said:
As far as i have understood correct, Sony does not have an equivalent Series S concept-version for PS, like PS4 LITE or PS5 LITE for example..Or does SLIM count as LITE version?

And now Sony comes with a regular version PS5 and waiting in the future for a superior PS5pro, and maybe a SLIM aka LITE??? version, while MS comes from start with a regular version XBOX series X and an inferior version Xbox Series S, and maybe in the future they wil throw a PRO equivalent, maybe Xbox Series XX, or X-pro, or pro-X?

I mean the Series S concept does not have equivalent in PS5? Am i correct? OR am i confused? Or will be a possible SLIM version that? :P

P.S.: Sorry if i sound stupid.. :)
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So far we dont know if the disksless version of the PS5 will be a bit underpowered like the XBSeriesS. They haven't really said if the only difference is having a disk drive.
What's interesting is that the Series S (a digital console) comes with half the storage of the Series X

slamsoze said:
Or to ask it more simple: Lets assume we all make a party, and you who bought PS5 and Xbox series X are like joining the part with Champagne. If i buy an Xbox Series S, will it be like i joined the party with a can of beer bought from the local corner shop?
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If you brought the Series S, you would still get the champagne, just maybe diluted with some water.... its still nice champagne, but not quite the full 100%
 
el niche said:
So far we dont know if the disksless version of the PS5 will be a bit underpowered like the XBSeriesS. They haven't really said if the only difference is having a disk drive.
What's interesting is that the Series S (a digital console) comes with half the storage of the Series X



If you brought the Series S, you would still get the champagne, just maybe diluted with some water.... its still nice champagne, but not quite the full 100%
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Thanx for info. This Series S concept confused me many times among years. Xbox ONE S 1 TB , here in Greece shipped at 199,00€ during many discount events the last years. It is a tempting price as it comes cheaper than my first N3DS used to cost! :)
And this price now at 299$ sounds good deal, for a back-up, secondary console!

And i know i will sound morron again, but if MS allowed using of Option Files on PES, i would go all in for an Xbox X, as the other games that i play online, if we said that amount of playerbase is a criterion, have already enough playerbase in Xbox platform.
 
el niche said:
So far we dont know if the disksless version of the PS5 will be a bit underpowered like the XBSeriesS. They haven't really said if the only difference is having a disk drive.
What's interesting is that the Series S (a digital console) comes with half the storage of the Series X



If you brought the Series S, you would still get the champagne, just maybe diluted with some water.... its still nice champagne, but not quite the full 100%
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They said it. It’s the same console just without a drive. You want me to look for a source?!

EhZaKUxXgAEkJ1B
 
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PRO_TOO said:
They said it. It’s the same console just without a drive. You want me to look for a source?!
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Oh I must have missed it. This makes the series S a compelling console for tight budgets as I doubt the PS5 digital can match it's price. I'm guessing PS5 Digital would be around $399.


slamsoze said:
Thanx for info. This Series S concept confused me many times among years. Xbox ONE S 1 TB , here in Greece shipped at 199,00€ during many discount events the last years. It is a tempting price as it comes cheaper than my first N3DS used to cost! :)
And this price now at 299$ sounds good deal, for a back-up, secondary console!

And i know i will sound morron again, but if MS allowed using of Option Files on PES, i would go all in for an Xbox X, as the other games that i play online, if we said that amount of playerbase is a criterion, have already enough playerbase in Xbox platform.
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I agree Microsoft naming schemes is not the best. Sony has it very simple with PS3, PS4, PS5 (Xbox 360, Xbox One, xbox one S, Xbox one X, Series X, Series S, WTF?)
It is a compelling device, especially for budget minded gamers and parents. Also easier pill to swallow for parents who in Xmas buy for their kids as next gen games might be more expensive.
I dont play in my console a lot, but at 299 its a tempting entry point.
 
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Instead of buying a new laptop (current one has a gtx 1550ti card) or purchasing a gaming PC, a cheaper option would be to get a 1440p 144hz monitor (don't have one at the moment) as well as the new Xbox Series S to play the next-gen games (will cost me around $600 for both the monitor and the Xbox). What do you guys think?
 
bsmaff said:
Why would you buy a 1440 144Hz monitor for a console?
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What do you mean by that? And what do you suggest?
Currently I have a 55 inches 4K 60hz TV, but I prefer higher refresh rates over higher resolution. Hence, going with the Series S as it would do the job.
 
You don't know if the Xbox would take advantage of a 144Hz screen, and consoles never have a 1440p option.
You would be better off saving your money and get a 120 or 144Hz 1080p monitor for higher frame rates or a half decent 4K monitor @60Hz.

https://displaysolutions.samsung.com/monitor/detail/1532/U28R55
The above monitor looks decent spec and has HDR10.
 
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Really good prices, got to say.

But I'm still not convinced. I'd want the £450 console, plus the best 50" TV I could get (that supports the enhanced sync options for smoother gameplay), and all in the hope of a football game that doesn't appear to be any different gameplay-wise.
 
Chris Davies said:
Really good prices, got to say.

But I'm still not convinced. I'd want the £450 console, plus the best 50" TV I could get (that supports the enhanced sync options for smoother gameplay), and all in the hope of a football game that doesn't appear to be any different gameplay-wise.
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Have a look at the LG C9 and up models.
Only ones I can recommend. Don’t go CX from 2020. Differences are minor. Go C from 2019. 55 is around 1300 euro. 65 around 1800 euro.
My 2 cents. :)

If you want to know more, feel free to ask mate.
 
rockstrongo said:
My game pass Ultimate is just about to end,had 18 months of converted Live gold ,and will get the normal game pass from October,if I hadn't had a year worth of EA play left,I'd deffo go back to ultimate again.
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Did you get a deal in ultimate? I feel everytime I get gamepass I get it for $1, it says its in beta, but I wonder when it will become full price (its gamepass PC btw).
 
rojofa said:
That's pretty much the problem though.

Games won't be able to do more in terms of AI/physics stuff that is essential for the gameplay than can be done playably on the specs of the lowest platform it's aimed at - the number of things happening on screen, online player count, destruction/deformation, physics based characters etc... The lowering of that bar makes less of that kind of stuff a possibility for next-gen games.
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el niche said:
AH, point taken, I do however feel the physics/AI aspects wont suffer so much with such difference in power, again its not like the lowest denominator console is 1000 times less powerful.
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If this is what industry people are saying:



...I think those of us looking for truly evolved games (and not just games built for the lowest common denominator, then ported) are going to get dumped on.

Casual gamers, and cross-play, are the priorities here. You can't cross-play if the game on the lowest-powered system has "physics model A", and the game on the high-powered system has "physics model B"...

They both use the same processor, granted, but there's still a significant power difference between the two when you're taking everything into the equation.

I've been toying with the idea of building a super-powered PC, but what's the point when the games I'd be buying it for - football games - are built for the base versions of the consoles? I may as well just get a console. And sigh.
 
el niche said:
Did you get a deal in ultimate? I feel everytime I get gamepass I get it for $1, it says its in beta, but I wonder when it will become full price (its gamepass PC btw).
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Yeah,I converted my live gold 18 months ago,and signed up for €1 (3 months) and that turned out to be a game pass Ultimate.
Since I don't play much on PC,I'm letting that ultimate game pass end when my 18 months are up (late October) and probably getting regular game pass (console only) for €9 a month, I'd probably get a deal when renewing it.

It's been a good thing for me,playing so many really good games that I wouldn't had otherwise.
Plus,since the standard price going from 59 to $69 for games,it's a good deal,I'm going to be careful which new ones I get,kinda pricey making mistakes...
 
Chris Davies said:
If this is what industry people are saying:

...I think those of us looking for truly evolved games (and not just games built for the lowest common denominator, then ported) are going to get dumped on.

Casual gamers, and cross-play, are the priorities here. You can't cross-play if the game on the lowest-powered system has "physics model A", and the game on the high-powered system has "physics model B"...
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:((

They're never going to do "Series X Exclusive" games or multiplayer so this is what we're stuck with this generation then. It'll make more money for them no doubt, but in a way it also seems like they're shooting themselves in the foot - they had the specs advantage over the PS5 so could have used that power for more impressive exclusives. Now they have to still make everything run on the Series S it's actually the PS5 which will be capable of technically superior exclusives.

I hope their controllers have better build quality this time as well - I bought an XB1 Elite controller a while ago and within a few months the rubber grips had fallen off, the sticks were drifting and the A button was double pressing. Not good for something with an RRP over £150.
 
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