PES 2011 Discussion thread

[Andy]

If i can get a guide on how to properly debug the scripts and maybe someone could create a tool to make it easier to mod the gameplay. So we can have a choice to play it how you want. Have a discussion on what the best settings are for the type of game you want.
!

Sorry Klash i meant to pick up on this earlier. Now that would be a fantastic tool,worth its weight in gold. (even though it weighs nothing lol)

He can't be serious...

I know crazy isnt it. the only thing i can think of is maybe its a command for the ai to let the player score an easy goal on beginner level. lets hope so anyway.

 

[kobayashi]

Yes, this is the one downside i find, it kinda takes the individualism away, although with recent patches i have found the ai closing me down quicker so it sort of compensates it a bit. But i agree its a minus for pes officianado,s.

Do you know what jenkys gameplay is like? I have tried it once but with the extra animations it felt a bit rigid again.or is that just me?

Jenkys is similar, bit less control, smoother, better physics but again pretty easy. It's just me dominating trying to break down the defence. Sometimes i thrash them. sometimes i just win, but it's always the same game

Didn't feel rigid to me, but didn't necessarily fell substantially smoother, but an great improvement and breakthrough anyway by the guy.

Also i have to say the PS3 version is definitively better gameplay wise after i did a few tests, i dunno if any of the official PC patches watered down the gameplay or something but there's none of this instant precision control on the PS3 version like with the PC. There's just something not right with the game.

Sorry Klash i meant to pick up on this earlier. Now that would be a fantastic tool,worth its weight in gold. (even though it weighs nothing lol)

Certainly, i wold just like to get tot eh bottom of this watered down PC gameplay issue. Get it to the PS3 standard than change the ball physics, remove stumbling and that would be great!

 

[Jimmy G-Force]

I know crazy isnt it. the only thing i can think of is maybe its a command for the ai to let the player score an easy goal on beginner level. lets hope so anyway.

More likely it's the Kick Off goal glitch. You very rarely dont score if you get the shot off. This is definately coded this way deliberately, it's even mentioned in the commentary.

 

[sincover]

Jenkys is similar, bit less control, smoother, better physics but again pretty easy. It's just me dominating trying to break down the defence. Sometimes i thrash them. sometimes i just win, but it's always the same game

Didn't feel rigid to me, but didn't necessarily fell substantially smoother, but an great improvement and breakthrough anyway by the guy.

Also i have to say the PS3 version is definitively better gameplay wise after i did a few tests, i dunno if any of the official PC patches watered down the gameplay or something but there's none of this instant precision control on the PS3 version like with the PC. There's just something not right with the game.



Certainly, i wold just like to get tot eh bottom of this watered down PC gameplay issue. Get it to the PS3 standard than change the ball physics, remove stumbling and that would be great!

Soooo the only way to enjoy PES 2011 is to play 15-20min halves on the PS3? I'm sorry but that just sounds like nonsense to me. I've played the PS3 version and the only difference I can see is the framerate (higher on my PC). The unpatched game plays exactly the same.
Whether or not you like Yair's and Jenkey's patches are totally a matter of your personal opinion. I don't know what you mean at all by 'removing the first touch' as the players still move differently according to their stats. Even after patching Messi's control is still very different than Puyol's. Jenkey's patch increases response times slightly by making animations feel a little more snappy, so maybe that's why you feel like there is a huge advantage over the AI?

 

[kobayashi]

Soooo the only way to enjoy PES 2011 is to play 15-20min halves on the PS3? I'm sorry but that just sounds like nonsense to me. I've played the PS3 version and the only difference I can see is the framerate (higher on my PC). The unpatched game plays exactly the same.

well back in September-November they were pretty much the same.

Now, i dunno. the PC one just seems really easy. Even the default. Seems 'flat' really. I'm not making this up, i'm not een trying to get people to play on the PS3 version. I just do not know wwhat the fuck is going on and why everyone saying these patches are amazing on PC but for me they don't work

Whether or not you like Yair's and Jenkey's patches are totally a matter of your personal opinion. I don't know what you mean at all by 'removing the first touch' as the players still move differently according to their stats.

I like jenkyes and i don't mind yairs stuff it's just i'm getting a little frustrated that people are saying it makes the AI much harder to beat but when i put he patches in they become easier? What am i don't wrong?

Even after patching Messi's control is still very different than Puyol's. Jenkey's patch increases response times slightly by making animations feel a little more snappy, so maybe that's why you feel like there is a huge advantage over the AI?

Well to explain what I'm doing when i play with yairs patch. Something that seems super effective when playing his patches which don't work on the default or PS3 version is to, well... play the game like FIFA.

Ping pong Pass forward, hold R2 and the left stick forward before you player gets the ball for a instant first touch and no loss of momentum , then repeat until you get a bit of space to shoot, cross etc..

What I'm noticing on the PS3 version is that they don't control the ball perfectly and keep the momentum going when you use R2 like they are in yairs patch or even in the konami 1.03 patch where first touch just seems easier than on the PS3

 

[sincover]

well back in September-November they were pretty much the same.

Now, i dunno. the PC one just seems really easy. Even the default. Seems 'flat' really. I'm not making this up, i'm not een trying to get people to play on the PS3 version. I just do not know wwhat the fuck is going on and why everyone saying these patches are amazing on PC but for me they don't work




I like jenkyes and i don't mind yairs stuff it's just i'm getting a little frustrated that people are saying it makes the AI much harder to beat but when i put he patches in they become easier? What am i don't wrong?




Well to explain what I'm doing when i play with yairs patch. Something that seems super effective when playing his patches which don't work on the default or PS3 version is to, well... play the game like FIFA.

Ping pong Pass forward, hold R2 and the left stick forward before you player gets the ball for a instant first touch and no loss of momentum , then repeat until you get a bit of space to shoot, cross etc..

What I'm noticing on the PS3 version is that they don't control the ball perfectly and keep the momentum going when you use R2 like they are in yairs patch or even in the konami 1.03 patch where first touch just seems easier than on the PS3

Ok I see what you mean now. Maybe you're just that good? (not trying to be sarcastic ) I still get whooped on Top Player, especially when playing with lower rated teams. Most often, my matches end up in draws, with the odd win here and there. I'd say it's a 55D-25W-20L ratio for me, which I can appreciate.

 

[Andy]

More likely it's the Kick Off goal glitch. You very rarely dont score if you get the shot off. This is definately coded this way deliberately, it's even mentioned in the commentary.

Yeah Jimmy i have heard you mention this before so maybe it does mean that.
I really cant think of a logical reason for this. why would they do that!!

 

[CalcioCalabrese]

Anyone else wish that the "Controlled Shots" where more like FIFA's? I keep forgetting there impossible to score outside the box.

Me
Well I wish the animation was better. They're not impossible outside the box though. I've scored a couple along the ground or in the air that were good...but had the ball's trajectory looked nicer, it would have been a lot better looking.

 

[Lami]

Just got my hands on PES 2011 Wii. I'm loving it to bits. Very responsive (just like it always was), great pace, defending much better, more GK animations, better ball swerve, better animations even though it is last gen, ball physics feel good plus ball speed, graphics aren't this gen but we all know that, shooting feels different to this gen's and varied.

Anyone here with a Wii, I really recommend you get a copy and give it a shot. Pretty sure you get it for cheap now. Totally worth it imo.

Fifa can learn a thing or two from this game. The flow of the game is just lovely.

 

[DarthKebab]

Just got my hands on PES 2011 Wii. I'm loving it to bits. Very responsive (just like it always was), great pace, defending much better, more GK animations, better ball swerve, better animations even though it is last gen, ball physics feel good plus ball speed, graphics aren't this gen but we all know that, shooting feels different to this gen's and varied.

Anyone here with a Wii, I really recommend you get a copy and give it a shot. Pretty sure you get it for cheap now. Totally worth it imo.

Fifa can learn a thing or two from this game. The flow of the game is just lovely.

I said this on my (now dead) blog, it is an amazing game, hope the dev team can make their version on the new Wii console.

Best game since 5.

 

[Lami]

I said this on my (now dead) blog, it is an amazing game, hope the dev team can make their version on the new Wii console.

Best game since 5.

How long you been playing it for Darth?

 

[DarthKebab]

How long you been playing it for Darth?

Since xmas, haven't been on it for 6 weeks though due to other stuff going on, new job etc.

But managed around 6 seasons of ML so far, the transfer system is realistic and excellent, even after winning CL twice Messi, Ronaldo etc still turned me down.

 

[SandTheMan]

The wii version is very good, fun and has a good varity in scoring. The game is really hard against the best teams and the player individuality is great. Its a bit fast and the passing is sometimes to assisted. I have a problem finding fair players online. I always come up against Barca, Real or United.

 

[Lami]

Since xmas, haven't been on it for 6 weeks though due to other stuff going on, new job etc.

But managed around 6 seasons of ML so far, the transfer system is realistic and excellent, even after winning CL twice Messi, Ronaldo etc still turned me down.

I've just started mine with ML players and lost my first 2 games. I need to get my formation and game right to start picking up points.

Good luck with your new job mate.

The wii version is very good, fun and has a good varity in scoring. The game is really hard against the best teams and the player individuality is great. Its a bit fast and the passing is sometimes to assisted. I have a problem finding fair players online. I always come up against Barca, Real or United.

I haven't tried online yet and tbh I don't think I will. Wouldn't want them idiots ruining my mood.

Good to know I ain't alone in this though, guys

 

[DarthKebab]

Cheers Lami, it is very tough at first, took me 3 seasons to win the league and Champions League, you look forward to playing the best teams more than the mdtable sides because the better teams attack leaving more space, the average teams stay rigid unless you break them down early.

Started a game as Barca with Espimas and company and its a decent challenge, must try to resist buying someone like Agbonlahor though as his pace is too powerful but sometimes when you are getting beat and need a result you cant help but pass it to him loads.

 

[johnking]

been pes2011 alot lately online in quick matches i always use spurs with similar tatics and when playing against opponents that use barca real madrid inter ac ,milan etc the game is so biased and scripted that at times its unplayable i can tell you sometimes when my opponent will score from a corner kick thats how scripted it is how can you go from being totally outplaying someone to the point that your players need half an hour to control a ball they dont seem to kick it properly and your players are sluggish its as tho scripting has kicked in and the AI is trying to even the game up i have even had my player stood with an open goal and refused to budge for the ball even when pressing the corresponding buttons offline i can understand scripting to a certain extent but online playing somebody else this is shocking i have just had to switch it off during a match if i had played anymore i would have broke the damn thing. come on konami fix these things.

 

[Isslander]

A seven line long sentence is quite hard to read.

 

[Jimmy G-Force]

been pes2011 alot lately online in quick matches i always use spurs with similar tatics and when playing against opponents that use barca real madrid inter ac ,milan etc the game is so biased and scripted that at times its unplayable i can tell you sometimes when my opponent will score from a corner kick thats how scripted it is how can you go from being totally outplaying someone to the point that your players need half an hour to control a ball they dont seem to kick it properly and your players are sluggish its as tho scripting has kicked in and the AI is trying to even the game up i have even had my player stood with an open goal and refused to budge for the ball even when pressing the corresponding buttons offline i can understand scripting to a certain extent but online playing somebody else this is shocking i have just had to switch it off during a match if i had played anymore i would have broke the damn thing. come on konami fix these things.

That is all in your mind.

 

[Rob92]

A seven line long sentence is quite hard to read.

Agreed.

That is all in your mind.

There can be times when it feels like the game is completely against you so in one respect I can see how people can come to this conclusion.

But I've come to realise that you really just need to accept responsibility for your poor results, or that you've been on the recieving end of more than your fair share of random annoying flaws with the game (player switching, AI stupidity etc.)

 

[johnking]

i wish it was all in my head.
i have played the game all through the pes and iss series, and played
loads online in pes2010 and now 2011 so i am well used to the game.

scripting has always been in the pes games to some degree but when playing online in pes 2010 the problem was lag for the majority of games
but in this version i have hardly noticed any.

i wish i had videoed some of the games i have played lately its been
unbelieveable for me i would say its some form of scripting
how do you explain players not moving or kicking the ball when there is an open net your defenders running up pitch when your opponents player recieves the ball in the penalty area your defender is stood at the side
of him but before you can switch to him the AI makes him run up the pitch,
thus leaving your opponent 1v1.
like i say i have played the game loads i know when i am playing somone who is good at the game and not so good so how can you go from battering someone in the first half to be hardly able to create anything in the second with your players under AI suddenly doing the most stupid of things sliding tacles to give pens when no button is pressed, stumbling,
taking an age to clear the ball or pass when you have pressed the corresponding buttons and just not responding, to me its as tho it is trying to level the game up.

 

[DarthKebab]

For Lami and others, my write up of Wii 2011

Ok, so far over the past year I have spent close to a thousand pounds on Pro Evolution Soccer, starting last year with the Wii version of Blue Samurai, mostly excellent let down by the poor keepers, then the trip to London, trains, overnight stay, nice food etc just for four hours play with a game I was already in the Master League Online beta, then the Playstation*plus subscription to play the demo, the preorder of the 360 version I still kept and now this past week the purchase of a Nintendo 3DS which was impossible to ignore due to a new PES game on that format.
However on Christmas eve 2010 my prayers for a classic version of the beautiful game were answered but it was not so apparent at first.

Now for me this game is not about playing with a wiimote, somersaulting across your room like an idiot so I also invested in the Classic Controller Pro.

So you load it up, it is underwhelming, as I got to find out the same songs play in the same order each time you load, simple menu screen, cannot change buttons on the controller either, I usually map the slide tackle button to the shoot button so this was a major change after years for me to adapt to.

My first task as always is to go straight into an exhibition game using Merseyside Blue, game starts up, its pretty dull and ugly, PS2 graphics made for the widescreen era, it’s a*tough adjustment to play this again after the next-gen*versions, the game kicks off, it is too familiar and I thought I made a mistake in buying this, I mean I played this game to death for years and I have just wasted money on something I can play in hi-res with authentic patch on my PC, so played a few dull games and it just took my enthusiasm away, mainly 0-0 draws.

So thought I would start a Master League on Top Player to try to find out if it had any tricks up its sleeve, initially after 5 games I bottom of the league, could not score, conceded silly goals from corners, very frustrating, but then it occurred to me, this is more like the old days except I had not learned this game yet.

Now to be honest the reason I held off so long in buying this game was the issue that has blighted the series on the Wii console, the goalkeepers, I assumed they dumbed the keepers down to compensate for the difficult control scheme they had introduced with the wiimote*and nunchuk*method, like it was tough enough to even reach the goal in the first place so your reward for this was an easy goal, so anyway, I read reviews on metacritic, there was only around 6 reviews and nothing mentioned the keepers, the forum buzz was non-existent at the time, so it was a risk and one I am glad I took. For me the highlight*of keeper ability was PES6, to my surprise they are on that level, it is incredible what improving this one area has done for the game on wii.

Another thing is the general AI, the opposition never give you anything easy, they seem to be aware of the passing lanes and stand in the way, you will struggle to put some moves together until you make the space for yourself, they have a good but not overbearing physicality and they seem to just be constantly aware of their positioning, you never see anyone just standing still, they are looking to pick up players or closing you down, it is frustrating at first, no, you are rubbish at first, the fact that every player just feels unique, whether it be how comfortable they control on the ball, how heavy they feel, what range of passing they can do, so you need to get to know your team’s strengths more than the oppositions weakness at times.

As the season progresses the game seem to reward you by opening up and almost in a weird way unlocking more randomness in the games, animations in the passing and shots you have not seen before, the way the games flow for you and against you just add to the tension, you never feel safe at 2-0 up, even against the lesser teams, I actually find a West Brom harder to play against than a Man Utd, as they keep things tighter and hope for a set piece, whereas the better teams attack you more and leave space.

A massive mention has to be the transfer system, it is the same as the older games but more strict on what you can buy, I was critical of the 360/PS3 versions for having a scout decide who comes to you rather than team prestige, on this even after winning the Champions League twice I still could not buy a Ronaldo*or Messi, I was only 14th in the Team Ranking, it has to be like this in the next gen*versions, it is realistic and makes you think about who is more suited to your team style, for example I have Fellaini*in midfield, his stats are not great but he is a wonderful strong player who can bulldoze into challenges and win the ball more, I cannot replace him with a smaller flair player as my team style would not be as effective.

Another thing which I did not like about previous Wii versions was the auto zoom of the camera as you got towards the goal, here it sits back as normal, showing you the full picture.

If I was to sum up when I knew this game was so special was when I thought my console was dying, unemployed I was trying to figure out how to afford a new console just for this game, thankfully it turned out to be the channel on my amplifier that was at fault so I just moved it onto another channel.

Now amidst all the positivity it does have some issues, one being when running onto a loose ball if you press pass the player will not make an effort to pass it, he has to control it first before you press the pass button.
Another issue is something which I believe is prevalent in almost every sports game but no less infuriating, some call it scripting, some call it superhuman AI, I call it a lot worse when it happens which is the unstoppable goals, you just know when the AI is going to score and you cannot stop it, usually off a corner which is where I think the majority of goals come from but it is the sheer feeling of being cheated, like your man is a ghost who looked favourite to win the ball, same happens for reaction times during stumbles and panic in the box, your player just does not seem to respond to button presses at times, leading to a goal for the AI, in real life this can happen but I sometimes think sports game can find a little more subtlety in finding a way to break you down.

Edit mode fans will not be happy, you can do everything you like to your own game but Nintendo will not allow SD card use on this to import an option file, there may be a way to do this if your console has been compromised but not sure.
Also you can only ever have one Master League game running on the console, you overwrite your old ML game if starting new.

In summary I was over the top with my write ups after the*four hours in London and then a week with the 360/PS3 versions at home, they have their good moments but to me are too exploitable, this game however has had around 300 games and over four seasons played on Master League which is obviously why the review is four months late, for me it is the natural successor to PES6, albeit a little worse looking if coming from PC, its the*same type of game with AI improvements, 360 dribbling and the randomness that can amaze even in a 0-0, I did find it a little easy after four seasons with the team of great players I built up, but the beauty is you still have your Master League default players to then turn into world beaters, something I am enjoying now.

 

[johnking]

after working friday night i put in pes2011 again played as spurs
quick matches as i always do. Played 7 games lost 5 with 2 draws
again the AI of my team was a complete shambles 2 defenders stood next to van persie on the edge of the box before i could get control of them
or the switching selecting them both moved away from the ball oblivious
to it or the opposition player again enableing my opponent to score.

In another game i was up against Barca my opponent hacked down any of my players that looked like getting free into space not one sending off
as the game looked to be heading for a 0-0 draw what happens one of my defencive players under AI decides to slide in on one of his players
in the penalty area ref gives a pen and sends my player off. He scores the pen 1-0 then in injury time defoe gets free down the left crosses into the box lennon with a diving header scores but the goal is disallowed
because the collision detection says lennon has fouled pique when quite clearly it was not a foul. This is what it has been like for the last 20 or so matches.
This has happened now on five seperate occasions where i get so many points then thats it whatever it is kicks in.

after this i played 7 matches as ac milan against the usual teams that people select madrid inter barca chelsea spain etc guess what WON 6 drew 1 this is the first time i have selected a major team to play as.
the difference was amazing it was like playing 2 different games!!
The diffence being like playing one of those driving racing games
where you drive with all the assists on.
the AI of my players was spot on covering defending ETc no random daft things from the AI like running away from the ball the player select
seemed to work okay no stumbleing of players when incontact with opposition defenders unlike playing as spurs lennon, defoe van de vaart
and pavelchenko would all stumble as soon as a defender got anywhere near them.
It just seems there is an unnatural bias towards the major sides in the game.

 

[kobayashi]

there is an indirect bias to bigger teams john. Don't worry you are certainly not shit. The problem is the regular is my friend.

It just hit me when i played a ranked match 15 mintues as a modist team (Benfica) against a other guy playing as Zenit and the game was, ridiclous, just like all other ranked games.

Yet i play with Bordeaux against Lille in a unranked game with Top player and the game shows what pes is all about.

I makes your team dumb, it makes your team liable to triple tap crosses, through balls and speed merchants and in general just meh rubbish play.

Don't go into quick ranked games with a 'football' mindset just play for the fun of it. I means nothing if these guys beat you when the Ai is set up to be stupid.

I bet you would have won 7 out of 7 if you played them on top player. That's why many here can't be fucked with ranked online. Do you use xbox? or PS3, if you use ps3 join Peel man

 

[Lami]

For Lami and others, my write up of Wii 2011

Good read Darth. About sums up my experience so far as well. Although I don't get why we can't edit controls on the Wii despite having it in all the PESs and WEs on PS2, PS3, and 360. I'm finding it a bit annoying to adapt to the controls but I guess I'll get used to it.

About the AI cheat, its almost inevitable. You know the tables will turn at some point and you try your best to stop it, to no avail. I do wish they find other ways too.

I also prefer the keepers, much more one arm stretch saves and 1-1 saves too.

 

[DarthKebab]

Good read Darth. About sums up my experience so far as well. Although I don't get why we can't edit controls on the Wii despite having it in all the PESs and WEs on PS2, PS3, and 360. I'm finding it a bit annoying to adapt to the controls but I guess I'll get used to it.

About the AI cheat, its almost inevitable. You know the tables will turn at some point and you try your best to stop it, to no avail. I do wish they find other ways too.

I also prefer the keepers, much more one arm stretch saves and 1-1 saves too.

I was back on it last night, struggling along with my team of crap, got some great goals saved in the gallery though so will try and get them uploaded at some point.

 

[Han]

after working friday night i put in pes2011 again played as spurs
quick matches as i always do. Played 7 games lost 5 with 2 draws
again the AI of my team was a complete shambles 2 defenders stood next to van persie on the edge of the box before i could get control of them
or the switching selecting them both moved away from the ball oblivious
to it or the opposition player again enableing my opponent to score.

In another game i was up against Barca my opponent hacked down any of my players that looked like getting free into space not one sending off
as the game looked to be heading for a 0-0 draw what happens one of my defencive players under AI decides to slide in on one of his players
in the penalty area ref gives a pen and sends my player off. He scores the pen 1-0 then in injury time defoe gets free down the left crosses into the box lennon with a diving header scores but the goal is disallowed
because the collision detection says lennon has fouled pique when quite clearly it was not a foul. This is what it has been like for the last 20 or so matches.
This has happened now on five seperate occasions where i get so many points then thats it whatever it is kicks in.

after this i played 7 matches as ac milan against the usual teams that people select madrid inter barca chelsea spain etc guess what WON 6 drew 1 this is the first time i have selected a major team to play as.
the difference was amazing it was like playing 2 different games!!
The diffence being like playing one of those driving racing games
where you drive with all the assists on.
the AI of my players was spot on covering defending ETc no random daft things from the AI like running away from the ball the player select
seemed to work okay no stumbleing of players when incontact with opposition defenders unlike playing as spurs lennon, defoe van de vaart
and pavelchenko would all stumble as soon as a defender got anywhere near them.
It just seems there is an unnatural bias towards the major sides in the game.

I see what you mean and I have been searching on the internet to found solutions. I found it in some posts of a guy at PESgaming.
Just read in THIS tread, starting from post 7. The guy is "IamaCanadianeh" and also read his follow-up-post #14. It is a good read with good advices, also about the settings he uses. It helped me a lot...

 

[Lami]

I was back on it last night, struggling along with my team of crap, got some great goals saved in the gallery though so will try and get them uploaded at some point.

Forgot to mention something REALLY important. Stamina is MUCH better than on the PS3/360. It plays according to who moves more on the pitch, unlike PS3/360 where at about 60-70mins everyone is on a red.

 

[Rob92]

Forgot to mention something REALLY important. Stamina is MUCH better than on the PS3/360. It plays according to who moves more on the pitch, unlike PS3/360 where at about 60-70mins everyone is on a red.

This is really annoying - makes BAL farcical really when trying to conserve energy is made pointless, and you can't tire out the opposition by making them chase the ball around... I havn't heard it mentioned in the PES 2012 news yet, but it badly needs fixing!

 

[kobayashi]

They need to go back to WE9LE for the stamina, it was much better then!

 

[DarthKebab]

Forgot to mention something REALLY important. Stamina is MUCH better than on the PS3/360. It plays according to who moves more on the pitch, unlike PS3/360 where at about 60-70mins everyone is on a red.

Yep, stops the urge to sprint as much, but not unrealistic as having to always change my team of no hopers.

Such a shame this team never worked on the PC version.