The Retro-PES Corner

Flipper the Priest said:
I haven't heard most of these, but one commenter says it's only lines you hear when he's set to be biased, whereas I always have him neutral.
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Just mentioned that in my last post actually and can confirm that's true - it seems as though quite a few other phrases that are neutral are only used when the commentary is player-specific for some reason, probably a result of lack of quality assurance/testing, I mean Trevor's lines are set to come in without bothering to check if Peter's have stopped and they generally tend to come in about half a second too early.

Would be nice to see a commentary patch to be honest for PES 2, since IMO it has some of the best 'player-individual' characteristics in the earlier PS2 titles IMO
 
On a similar subject to my post above (i.e. things in PES that were a bit crap back in the day, and are still crap now).

There's just no innovation at all in PES (which is why I'm pinning all my hopes on the reboot). Even when it comes down to licenses.

Someone made this point the other day (really sorry, I can't find who it was now), but... Vive Le Football. A mobile football game. No licenses.

Look at how they present their fake leagues:

V87FMBH.png


If I was tasked with making "fantasy" versions of each league logo, that is exactly what they'd look like. I prefer most of them to the real logos. It's only the names, i.e. "Spain League" and "England League", that I don't like - because they're gramatically wrong, for a start.

Compare that to Konami's versions:

pro-evo-crests.png


I hate it. Honestly, I feel that strongly about it. It's so lazy. Like so much of the creative output, and that same "it'll do" attitude seems prevalent across the whole title, with the gameplay just about saving the game, every year. (I know I'm not the first to say it, it's not exactly a "hot take", but it makes me angry to this day.)

I mean, when you look at the team badges:

emblem_0173.png


How is that in any way, shape or form (other than the colour) a Manchester City themed badge?

It's not quirky, it's just shite.

(Sorry, Retro-Pes Corner, don't beat me up... :D)
 
Tbh at least it was laughably piss-poor and somewhat consistent back then, now it's just generically bland to the point of boredom and seemingly inconsistent. Like how the naming schemes have changed over time but there's fragments of the older ones everywhere.
 
Chris Davies said:
I think I'm one of the few who would say "I definitely would" to this.

I realise I may be in a minority, but I have no fond nostalgic feelings about "CELERY! CELERY!" or being forcibly locked to the original ML players. Those things were crap then and they're crap now.

(In an attempt to provide evidence of this - in PES 2021, do you choose to play as the "ML default" players, and do you look at the banners that say "WE'RE HERE TO WIN" and think they're great? I would bet the answers are "no" and "hell no".)

They may remind you of a better time, but those times wouldn't have been ruined if the banners didn't say stupid things.
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Chris Davies said:
On a similar subject to my post above (i.e. things in PES that were a bit crap back in the day, and are still crap now).

There's just no innovation at all in PES (which is why I'm pinning all my hopes on the reboot). Even when it comes down to licenses.

Someone made this point the other day (really sorry, I can't find who it was now), but... Vive Le Football. A mobile football game. No licenses.

Look at how they present their fake leagues:

V87FMBH.png


If I was tasked with making "fantasy" versions of each league logo, that is exactly what they'd look like. I prefer most of them to the real logos. It's only the names, i.e. "Spain League" and "England League", that I don't like - because they're gramatically wrong, for a start.

Compare that to Konami's versions:

pro-evo-crests.png


I hate it. Honestly, I feel that strongly about it. It's so lazy. Like so much of the creative output, and that same "it'll do" attitude seems prevalent across the whole title, with the gameplay just about saving the game, every year. (I know I'm not the first to say it, it's not exactly a "hot take", but it makes me angry to this day.)

I mean, when you look at the team badges:

emblem_0173.png


How is that in any way, shape or form (other than the colour) a Manchester City themed badge?

It's not quirky, it's just shite.

(Sorry, Retro-Pes Corner, don't beat me up... :D)
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Who hurt you, Chris? :LOL:

In seriousness, I get you. I was far from jovial about it at time of release. It was as infuriating as it was inexplicable, certainly on the PS2. To treat the gameplay with such attention and respect - with, comparatively, a sliver of care to presentation - was and still is baffling. Baggio and his ponytail dancing through defences to the backdrop of HELLOW MUM.

One question I'd like asked of Konami is indeed why did they veer so far from reality. Increasingly so over time. I've used the example before of the Joneses, Cobi and Kenwyne. Cobi was Johns in PES. Kenwyne was Jibohou in PES6. Why? And then circa 2012 it became worse still, with every fake name looking like that of a Mexican god or the final innings of Scrabble.

I guess when it comes to the older games I've become desensitised. Maybe it's because a lot of these elements are so readily modded out of the game, which possibly fed the developers' complacency. Perhaps in my old age I've become more forgiving, especially when new football games have no soul. All said, I will absolutely be disappointed if - after an alleged root and branch overhaul - that lack of care is taken in PES 2022.
 
I remember one of my first football games was International Superstar Soccer for PS 1. The commentary was so ridiculously bad that it was funny. In later games it was just boring to hear the same sentences every game, so I started to play without any commentary a long time ago and never went back. I prefer to listen to some music when playing, especially with retro patches like for old World Cups.
 
I have taken to having the commentary really low these days and sometimes off. I wish there was an option to do that with real matches instead of listening to Jamie Carragher basically do audio description to every f***ing replay.


I've just remembered another nugget that always made me laugh. Being patronised by Trevor Brooking with his "but well done for trying" :LOL: Usually after a particularly wayward shot.
 
I'm more inclined to turn off commentary in newer games. Probably called it a day around 2011 and instead just have crowd noise or music or a podcast. Commentary has only gotten more annoying as time has gone on, for me. Less is more. Those rehearsed, set piece lines about players or teams can get in the sea.
 
I play without commentary, sometimes IM THE COMMENTATOR , honestly i feel better saying HERE IS GERRARD SCREAMING A F***ING 40YARD SCREAMEEEEERRR than listening to OHH HE SCORED FROM 40 YARDS tbf
 
Fenomeno9 said:
I remember one of my first football games was International Superstar Soccer for PS 1. The commentary was so ridiculously bad that it was funny.
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Mostly due to godawful programming if anything. It's not even the lines in themselves for the most part, they can pass as decent enough especially in PES 5/6, but the way they're programmed in seems to play the same few lines over and over to the point it can take one years to hear every single line. :P

Like, take "I tell a lie, he's missed". That's supposed to play within context of a very specific line of commentary in PES 2, but it instead decides to play as an alternative to "But no, he's missed!" at random.

And as I asked before, why is it pre-PES 4 session recordings sounded like a robot intonating instead of a human? (It's worse still in 4 with the mish mash of lines from previous games being mixed in)
 
I'm not sure about it.

But, when you start an exhibition game before playing a ML game, your opposite will change his line-up (in ML)

I tried it on PES6 and 2008 PC
 
Chris Davies said:
On a similar subject to my post above (i.e. things in PES that were a bit crap back in the day, and are still crap now).

There's just no innovation at all in PES (which is why I'm pinning all my hopes on the reboot). Even when it comes down to licenses.

Someone made this point the other day (really sorry, I can't find who it was now), but... Vive Le Football. A mobile football game. No licenses.

Look at how they present their fake leagues:

If I was tasked with making "fantasy" versions of each league logo, that is exactly what they'd look like. I prefer most of them to the real logos. It's only the names, i.e. "Spain League" and "England League", that I don't like - because they're gramatically wrong, for a start.

Compare that to Konami's versions:

I hate it. Honestly, I feel that strongly about it. It's so lazy. Like so much of the creative output, and that same "it'll do" attitude seems prevalent across the whole title, with the gameplay just about saving the game, every year. (I know I'm not the first to say it, it's not exactly a "hot take", but it makes me angry to this day.)

I mean, when you look at the team badges:

How is that in any way, shape or form (other than the colour) a Manchester City themed badge?

It's not quirky, it's just shite.

(Sorry, Retro-Pes Corner, don't beat me up... :D)
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I love this post, I've been going trough the PS1 & early PS2 games last week and even those ones took far more risk when it came to obvious player names and teams, Only swapping a few letters around. Even the PS1 games had accurate kits and i'm sure because of the low resolution, They could maybe argue plausible deniability that that's not a Nike logo on Brazil's shirt.

But in FOX engine PES, The fake teams don't even wear the accurate colours of the teams they represent now which is just stupid.
 
Meazza84 said:
OMG, it's full of stars! (Valderrama, Hernandez, Stoichkov, Matthaus, Etcheverry )

The hardest Konami PS1 title, it has an additional difficulty level (which I played on). I think all PS1 patches should be made on this game, it's much better than WE 2002.

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I've sung the praises of the MLS GameNight on here before and it likely gets overlooked because it's MLS, but I too always found it slightly better than the original ISS/ISS2 games. And you're right, this era of MLS gets rough treatment because of its silly uniforms and team names, among others, but there were some great players that still had something left to give.

Chris Davies said:
On a similar subject to my post above (i.e. things in PES that were a bit crap back in the day, and are still crap now).

There's just no innovation at all in PES (which is why I'm pinning all my hopes on the reboot). Even when it comes down to licenses.

Someone made this point the other day (really sorry, I can't find who it was now), but... Vive Le Football. A mobile football game. No licenses.

Look at how they present their fake leagues:

V87FMBH.png


If I was tasked with making "fantasy" versions of each league logo, that is exactly what they'd look like. I prefer most of them to the real logos. It's only the names, i.e. "Spain League" and "England League", that I don't like - because they're gramatically wrong, for a start.

Compare that to Konami's versions:

pro-evo-crests.png


I hate it. Honestly, I feel that strongly about it. It's so lazy. Like so much of the creative output, and that same "it'll do" attitude seems prevalent across the whole title, with the gameplay just about saving the game, every year. (I know I'm not the first to say it, it's not exactly a "hot take", but it makes me angry to this day.)
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I agree with your sentiment, but I think it's difficult to project 2021 graphical standards to a game that is over 15 years older. Those Vive Le Football logos are beautiful — and some of them are better than the actual logos the competitions use — but they are walking a really fine line on trademark infringement, particularly the French Ligue 1 version. I doubt Konami (or anyone) at the time was willing to stick its neck that far out and get sued, especially when the game was the most popular (I think) football game of the era. I'm a former graphic designer, and partially why I moved on was the difficulty working in a culture that accepts blatantly ripping off intellectual property and passing it off as their own. This mobile game likely paid a designer a small amount to create these, to boot. Sorry, I'll get off my soapbox now 😊

werwere.jpg

Konami likely mimicked the look and feel of real J-League logos (seen above) back then. If you squint a little bit, they all sorta look like fake PES teams 😂
 
Next up it's Group E in Euro 2020.

Poland (me) v Slovakia
Sweden (me) v Spain

Once again some cracking games and some cracking shots. Always seeing different types of shots in this game and most impressively they are from the CPU.

Enjoy! :)

 
goalgerd said:
its based on shollyms classic patches, ive just added new teams from this century and totally rebuilt the gameplay from scratch, also updated the boots, balls ,stadiums and kits


Heres some AI V AI Gameplay, Fabinhos had a mare ... (apologies for bad sound)


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this is excellent!
 
Final 1st fixtures in the 'group of death' coming up.

Hungary (me) v Portugal
Germany (me) v France

I suppose with the 4 best 3rd placed teams qualifying too it gives all these big 'uns a chance to progress.

 
@geeeeee Nice video :) Haven't heard Life Of Riley in ages, always liked that song. Some great AI goals there too! The through ball from Moutinho and the lob by Ronaldo was the pick of the AI goals for me although it was a close run thing. Cracker from Ward-Prowse too.
 
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